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  • discrimination in sports??

    I guess not everyone has moved on, sounds familiar of a time long ago:
    Torii Hunter: Having an openly gay teammate would ‘be difficult and uncomfortable’
    Citing his religious upbringing, Detroit Tigers slugger Torii Hunter told the Los Angeles Times that having an openly homosexual teammate would be tough to deal with. And it would be a divisive issue for any Major League Baseball team.

    Quoted by reporter Kevin Baxter of the Times in his Sunday story — "In pro sports, gay athletes still feel unwelcome" — Hunter indicated he would not — or could not — be supportive of a teammate with a different sexual orientation than his own:

    ... Hunter, among baseball's most thoughtful and intelligent players, isn't kidding when he says an "out" teammate could divide a team.

    "For me, as a Christian … I will be uncomfortable because in all my teachings and all my learning, biblically, it's not right," he says. "It will be difficult and uncomfortable."

    Kudos to Hunter for his honesty. But he needs to realize a few things.

    One, after playing nearly 2,000 major league games, Hunter probably has had at least one gay teammate already. Two, when has the sexual orientation of any teammate (assuming they've all been straight) mattered in how many games a team has won? Did the Tigers get to the World Series in 2012 because Justin Verlander is in a relationship with Kate Upton? How would it matter if Verlander dated someone named Bob Upton?

    Three, using Christianity to hide behind bigotry is totally unfair to Christians who don't consider being gay "not right." And even a literal, so-called "fundamental" reading of the Bible requires some interpretation. People believe what they want to believe. Saying you don't like gays because you also say you're Christian just isn't good enough.

    Hunter might be right about the issue being divisive. A major league clubhouse can very much be a boys club, overflowing with testosterone and full of jocular "humor" that might threaten a gay person. But ballplayers aren't dumb. As soon as they realize a gay teammate can hit a home run just like a straight one can, they'll ignore whatever details they might find disagreeable. They might even come to like or love the teammate. And if Hunter is as devoted to the Bible as he says, he might find reading material in there about that, too.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-bi...0197--mlb.html
    To each is their own when it comes to your beliefs, but I just laugh at his statement. When others had similar comments prior to Jackie Robinson playing with the Dodgers.

    Any other thoughts on this?
    I'd rather be judged by 12 rather carried by 6.

    It should be noted that any and all post that are made are based on my own thought and opinions.

  • #2
    Why aren't women allowed in MLB?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Crazed View Post
      Why aren't women allowed in MLB?
      I think I see what you're gettin' at here... No women in MLB... Why would an organization not allow women?.. It's what I've suspected all along.. MLB is homosexual conspiracy.
      "No one can make you feel like a turd without your permission." - Eleanor Roosevelt.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by moparfan View Post
        I guess not everyone has moved on, sounds familiar of a time long ago:
        Torii Hunter: Having an openly gay teammate would ‘be difficult and uncomfortable’
        Citing his religious upbringing, Detroit Tigers slugger Torii Hunter told the Los Angeles Times that having an openly homosexual teammate would be tough to deal with. And it would be a divisive issue for any Major League Baseball team.

        Quoted by reporter Kevin Baxter of the Times in his Sunday story — "In pro sports, gay athletes still feel unwelcome" — Hunter indicated he would not — or could not — be supportive of a teammate with a different sexual orientation than his own:

        ... Hunter, among baseball's most thoughtful and intelligent players, isn't kidding when he says an "out" teammate could divide a team.

        "For me, as a Christian … I will be uncomfortable because in all my teachings and all my learning, biblically, it's not right," he says. "It will be difficult and uncomfortable."

        Kudos to Hunter for his honesty. But he needs to realize a few things.

        One, after playing nearly 2,000 major league games, Hunter probably has had at least one gay teammate already. Two, when has the sexual orientation of any teammate (assuming they've all been straight) mattered in how many games a team has won? Did the Tigers get to the World Series in 2012 because Justin Verlander is in a relationship with Kate Upton? How would it matter if Verlander dated someone named Bob Upton?

        Three, using Christianity to hide behind bigotry is totally unfair to Christians who don't consider being gay "not right." And even a literal, so-called "fundamental" reading of the Bible requires some interpretation. People believe what they want to believe. Saying you don't like gays because you also say you're Christian just isn't good enough.

        Hunter might be right about the issue being divisive. A major league clubhouse can very much be a boys club, overflowing with testosterone and full of jocular "humor" that might threaten a gay person. But ballplayers aren't dumb. As soon as they realize a gay teammate can hit a home run just like a straight one can, they'll ignore whatever details they might find disagreeable. They might even come to like or love the teammate. And if Hunter is as devoted to the Bible as he says, he might find reading material in there about that, too.

        http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-bi...0197--mlb.html
        To each is their own when it comes to your beliefs, but I just laugh at his statement. When others had similar comments prior to Jackie Robinson playing with the Dodgers.

        Any other thoughts on this?
        My thoughts are that some people are as clueless as humanly possible. Where's the discrimination? How it disrimination to say it would be tough to deal with open homosexuality on the team? Have you ever been in a locker room? They probably don't have seperate suites. I can tell you that being in close military quarters it would not have gone over well so I can sympathize with him.

        Also, please explain how 2,000 years of biblical exegesis on homosexuality suddenly needs creativity to see anything wrong with it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Crazed View Post
          Why aren't women allowed in MLB?
          Show me anything that says women are not allowed. When it comes to gender, the issue is the ability to compete on the same level. I am sure if if a woman could hit a ball 450 feet there would be no issue. I am not saying that I know for sure that a woman couldn't. However, I am not aware of any female who has physically proven she could play on a man's level in any of the four major sports yet was denied.

          Unlike gender; race, religion and sexual orientation have no impact on a person's ability to compete on the same level.


          "Jerry, just remember, it’s not a lie if you believe it". George Constanza.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by JasperST View Post
            My thoughts are that some people are as clueless as humanly possible. Where's the discrimination? How it disrimination to say it would be tough to deal with open homosexuality on the team? Have you ever been in a locker room? They probably don't have seperate suites. I can tell you that being in close military quarters it would not have gone over well so I can sympathize with him.

            Also, please explain how 2,000 years of biblical exegesis on homosexuality suddenly needs creativity to see anything wrong with it.
            Nobody is asking for the Bible to change. And saying that a person's lifestyle makes you uncomfortable is not really a big deal either. Where the discrimination comes in is when he says things like it would divide the clubhouse. In other words, if it were up for a vote, Hunter's vote would be no. That, IMO, is discrimination. It's also not very Christian to deny a person who has the ability to do the same job you do, the opportunity to do so.

            Baseball, for those talented enough to be able to play for a living, is a job, nothing more, nothing less. Most of us work with Christians, Muslims, Blacks, Jews and women every day and it has no impact on our ability to accomplish the mission. Unless someone is a criminal, particularly a thief, there shouldn't be any distrust of them in the workplace and therefore no effect on morale. What happens outside the workplace should not impact what takes place in the workplace.

            Speaking of what happens outside the workplace, it always amazes me how pro athletes are so tolerant of wife beaters, drunk drivers and dog killers but would refuse to play with a gay athlete.


            "Jerry, just remember, it’s not a lie if you believe it". George Constanza.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by JasperST View Post
              Also, please explain how 2,000 years of biblical exegesis on homosexuality suddenly needs creativity to see anything wrong with it.
              Seeing it as wrong is one thing. Denying employment because of it is another.

              Additionally, a denial of employment for a religious reason (like that listed above) would also constitute discrimination.
              Stupidity should be a felony so that they lose the right to vote.

              Comment


              • #8
                And for those who don't know this, Hunter has four babies by four different baby mommas. I guess he skipped that part of the Bible, unless you believe he was married to all four.


                "Jerry, just remember, it’s not a lie if you believe it". George Constanza.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ex Army MP View Post
                  Nobody is asking for the Bible to change. And saying that a person's lifestyle makes you uncomfortable is not really a big deal either. Where the discrimination comes in is when he says things like it would divide the clubhouse. In other words, if it were up for a vote, Hunter's vote would be no. That, IMO, is discrimination. It's also not very Christian to deny a person who has the ability to do the same job you do, the opportunity to do so.
                  Wrong. Having an opinion isn't discrimination. Discrimination is an act. And changing or not changing the Bible isn't the issue either. You are also convieniently omitting the fact that there's a locker room situation involved, not whether a hotdog vendor can be gay or not.
                  Baseball, for those talented enough to be able to play for a living, is a job, nothing more, nothing less. Most of us work with Christians, Muslims, Blacks, Jews and women every day and it has no impact on our ability to accomplish the mission. Unless someone is a criminal, particularly a thief, there shouldn't be any distrust of them in the workplace and therefore no effect on morale. What happens outside the workplace should not impact what takes place in the workplace.

                  Speaking of what happens outside the workplace, it always amazes me how pro athletes are so tolerant of wife beaters, drunk drivers and dog killers but would refuse to play with a gay athlete.
                  I'm amazed that you can't understand why a guy might not want open homosexuality in the workplace if the workplace includes nudity. I'd love to be in a women's locker room too but for some odd reason it isn't allowed.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ex Army MP View Post
                    And for those who don't know this, Hunter has four babies by four different baby mommas. I guess he skipped that part of the Bible, unless you believe he was married to all four.
                    How is that relevant? You can't have an opinion on homosexuality if you've had kid's out of wedlock?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by moparfan View Post
                      "For me, as a Christian … I will be uncomfortable because in all my teachings and all my learning, biblically, it's not right," he says. "It will be difficult and uncomfortable."
                      This quote sounds pretty typical for most situations where so called 'Christians' choose to ignore the most basic teachings of their religion when it comes to do with anything they don't personally like.

                      Romans 15:5-7:
                      May the God of endurance and encouragement grant you to live in such harmony with one another, in accord with Christ Jesus, that together you may with one voice glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore welcome one another as Christ has welcomed you, for the glory of God.


                      Originally posted by JasperST View Post
                      How is that relevant? You can't have an opinion on homosexuality if you've had kid's out of wedlock?
                      It's relevant because he's trying to claim the holier-than-thou-ness of Christianity. Instead of just saying "It makes me uncomfortable and I wouldn't like it." he resorts to using religion as a shield.
                      Last edited by LINY; 12-31-2012, 11:58 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hunter is no saint....as Ex Army MP pointed out above. But I didn't care for the tone of this article.

                        It seems that if you are of the belief that homosexuality is a sinful lifestyle, the media/Hollywood claim you are a bigot and a religous nut.

                        Hunter, like so many other Christians, has his own feelings on what the bible says. IF Hunter is hateful torwards gay people, that is a problem -- showing hate is wrong and not Chirst-like. But if Hunter simply disagrees with the homoseuxal lifestyle, I don't see any problem.
                        "In the End, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends." - Martin Luther King, Jr

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by JasperST View Post
                          How is that relevant? You can't have an opinion on homosexuality if you've had kid's out of wedlock?
                          LINY answered this pretty well. His opinion had nothing to do with showers, rather, his selective interpretation of the Bible. He made Christianity the issue.


                          "Jerry, just remember, it’s not a lie if you believe it". George Constanza.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jacob2899 View Post
                            Hunter is no saint....as Ex Army MP pointed out above. But I didn't care for the tone of this article.

                            It seems that if you are of the belief that homosexuality is a sinful lifestyle, the media/Hollywood claim you are a bigot and a religous nut.

                            Hunter, like so many other Christians, has his own feelings on what the bible says. IF Hunter is hateful torwards gay people, that is a problem -- showing hate is wrong and not Chirst-like. But if Hunter simply disagrees with the homoseuxal lifestyle, I don't see any problem.
                            I am sure many players disagree with wife beating, dog fighting and drunk driving too. But they don't seem to say they would not want to play with someone because of these things.

                            Nobody said he couldn't have an opinion. But when you express your opinion, particularly when it's about your desire or willingness to exclude a particular segment of the population, you should expect backlash.


                            "Jerry, just remember, it’s not a lie if you believe it". George Constanza.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by JasperST View Post
                              Wrong. Having an opinion isn't discrimination. Discrimination is an act. And changing or not changing the Bible isn't the issue either. You are also convieniently omitting the fact that there's a locker room situation involved, not whether a hotdog vendor can be gay or not.
                              I'm amazed that you can't understand why a guy might not want open homosexuality in the workplace if the workplace includes nudity. I'd love to be in a women's locker room too but for some odd reason it isn't allowed.
                              So, if this is a valid argument, it applies to the military, the police force, fire departments, professional locker rooms and just about any other occupation where at some point you're expected to share close quarters or showers. You've now successfully excluded gays from a large segment of the workforce. And some corporations have gym and shower facilities for employees to use during their lunch hour. I guess gays can't work their either. And every workplace, at a minimum, has restrooms where people of the same sex use at the same time. Guess gays can't work there either.

                              I guess what you're saying is that gays can only work from home or be on welfare.


                              "Jerry, just remember, it’s not a lie if you believe it". George Constanza.

                              Comment

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