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  • Court: Student needn't stand for Pledge

    http://www.miamiherald.com/news/brea...ry/616493.html

    Court: Student needn't stand for PledgePosted on Thu, Jul. 24, 2008 By NIRVI SHAH
    [email protected]d.com

    A federal appeals court upheld the right of a former Palm Beach County high school student to refuse to stand for the Pledge of Allegiance but did not say whether that right should extend to all students.

    In 2005, Boynton Beach High student Cameron Frazier sued the school district, state education commissioner and state Board of Education after a teacher forced him to stand during the Pledge, even though he had a note from his mother excusing his participation.

    A state law requires people to stand when the Pledge is recited.

    The ruling doesn't strike down the law or extend to other students, said Randall Marshall, legal director for the American Civil Liberties Union in Florida who argued the suit on behalf of Frazier.

    But the ruling by the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals could trigger more lawsuits if other students are forced to stand for the Pledge, Marshall said. ''Based on this ruling, it is unimaginable that any Florida school district could punish a high school student for refusing to stand for the Pledge,'' Marshall said in a statement. ``Any school district in Florida that requires a student to stand and recite the Pledge, and punishes them for not doing so, will be inviting litigation.''

    Broward school district spokesman Keith Bromery said students do need to bring in a note from their parents to be exempt from participating in the Pledge.

    ''If somebody does not want to do it, it's their right to opt out,'' Bromery said. ``They cannot disrupt the procedure.''
    Where is the rspect fo the country?...Dear teacher I don't want my child standing for the pledge...
    sigpic

  • #2
    Make his @55 wait outside. He wants to be a disruption to the class during the pledge? Make him wait outside.

    On the team I'm on now, we always say the pledge on the first day of the new pay period. It felt kind of odd the first time I saw it, but I jumped right in. Now it feels like a rite of membership into the team.

    I love the USA.

    I pledge allegiance to the flag,
    of the United States of America,
    and to the republic for which it stands,
    one nation, under God, indivisible,
    with liberty and justice for all.
    Last edited by Looker; 07-24-2008, 02:14 PM.

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    • #3
      Another example where people have fought and died for your right to be disrespectful. And yes, it is disrespectful.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Looker View Post
        Make his @55 wait outside. He wants to be a disruption to the class during the pledge? Make him wait outside.

        On the team I'm on now, we always say the pledge on the first day of the new pay period. It felt kind of odd the first time I saw it, but I jumped right in. Now it feels like a rite of membership into the team.

        I love the USA.

        I pledge allegiance to the flag,
        of the United States of America,
        and to the republic for which it stands,
        one nation, under God, indivisible,
        with liberty and justice for all.
        That's pretty cool...

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        • #5
          I remeber in school the last time we stood up for the pledge everyday was in elementry...In middle school and high school it was once in a blue moon...We stood for the pledge the days after 9/11, after that we went back to not standing up or saying the pledge...
          sigpic

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          • #6
            Even when I was in elementary school I understood that the beauty of America is that I was not required to do the pledge if I didn't feel like it. Personally I felt it was a little like brainwashing to expect young children to pledge their allegiance to anything. But I still happily said the pledge every day with my hand on my heart. I even learned it in Spanish (sadly).

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            • #7
              I dont mind standing for the pledge because I love my country but I just skip the "god" part

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              • #8
                Screw this turd. I hope he and his mother get stranded on a desert island with a bunch of cannibals. Is there any doubt our country is going down the tubes. F*$% them and their lawyer to. AND THE IDIOT JUDGE.
                Space for rent .........

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Southflaguy View Post
                  http://www.miamiherald.com/news/brea...ry/616493.html



                  Where is the rspect fo the country?...Dear teacher I don't want my child standing for the pledge...
                  During my senior year in high school I was the ONLY student in a class of about 20 that stood for the pledge. The teacher would sometimes stand. Sometimes some of the idiots would actually try to give me a hard time about it. It boggled my mind.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Southflaguy View Post
                    I remeber in school the last time we stood up for the pledge everyday was in elementry...In middle school and high school it was once in a blue moon...We stood for the pledge the days after 9/11, after that we went back to not standing up or saying the pledge...
                    How old are you?

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                    • #11
                      I recite the Pledge on occasions where it is used. I even sing the Star Spangled Banner in my off-key voice. But I don't see why it is such a big deal that people will condemn someone to a desert island with cannibals for the simple act of refusing to stand for the pledge.

                      I pledge allegiance to a country for which the FIRST AMENDMENT is central to all else. Freedom of speech, if it means anything at all, means freedom to believe and think contrary to the majority. If someone for whatever reason objects to standing for the pledge of allegiance that is his or her right to do so.

                      Thankfully we live in a country where you can believe such a person should be so condemned, but you can't make it happen.
                      Hatred never ceases by hatred, but by love alone is healed.
                      Happiness never decreases by being shared. -- Buddhist quotation
                      A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. -- Proverbs 15:1

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                      • #12
                        Like Southflaguy, we only did it in elementary school. After that it was never done.

                        Hate to say it but... isn't saying it's unlawful for a student to protest a pledge of allegiance to what is supposed to be a free country a bit contradictory? Doesn't having this kind of law sort of kill the point and idea of America?

                        Not that I have a problem with standing, I'm about as patriotic as they come. I think this infringes on rights though.

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                        • #13
                          The judge ruled appropriately. I'm surprised that some of you would have such a disrespect of our constitution to call his ruling idiotic. If he had ruled banning handguns is legal I can only imagine the insults you would have hurled. Our rights are extremely important and must be defended even if it is sometimes unpopular.

                          Nobody should be compelled by our government to stand up and pledge. I don't need to pledge. My commitment to my country is deeply ingrained. Suggesting that I need to voice my allegience almost trivializes it. I don't need to say JACK SQUAT to be just as much a patriot as anybody else. I don't know what the kid's reason is for not standing up and saying the pledge but it doesn't matter one bit to me. The law is not constitutional.

                          Just because a person does not participate in these rituals does not necessarily mean they aren't allegiant to our country. Also, the student remaining seated is not a disruption at all. Leave the damn kid alone.
                          -I don't feel you honor someone by creating a physical gesture (the salute). You honor them by holding them in memory and, in law enforcement, proceeding in vigilant, ethical police work. You honor this country or deceased soldiers or whatever you're honoring when you salute a flag by thinking, feeling, and continuing a life of freedom.

                          --ArkansasRed24

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                          • #14
                            I can't believe that it's a freakin law that you must stand for the pledge! What are we in communist China? I'm envisioning soldiers with ak47s standing behind school children making sure they stand.

                            I personally have always stood and always will but I appreciate the 1st amendment enough to know that it should be others' right not to stand.

                            Maybe if our government wasn't so screwed up we wouldn't have so many people ****ed off and not wanting to stand.
                            Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by djack16 View Post
                              The judge ruled appropriately. I'm surprised that some of you would have such a disrespect of our constitution to call his ruling idiotic. If he had ruled banning handguns is legal I can only imagine the insults you would have hurled. Our rights are extremely important and must be defended even if it is sometimes unpopular.

                              Nobody should be compelled by our government to stand up and pledge. I don't need to pledge. My commitment to my country is deeply ingrained. Suggesting that I need to voice my allegience almost trivializes it. I don't need to say JACK SQUAT to be just as much a patriot as anybody else. I don't know what the kid's reason is for not standing up and saying the pledge but it doesn't matter one bit to me. The law is not constitutional.

                              Just because a person does not participate in these rituals does not necessarily mean they aren't allegiant to our country. Also, the student remaining seated is not a disruption at all. Leave the damn kid alone.
                              I don't think anyone called the judge's ruling idiotic nor disrespected the Constitution. However, if one does not participate in a "ritual" affirming their allegiance to their country, then yes, it could be construed they are not. Let's not forget, in this forum we should be able to vent our frustration about court rulings and the actions or inactions of others without the reprisal or condemnation from our peers. If we believe it's right to recite the pledge and someone goes out of their way not to, then yes, we should be able to say they are not patriotic and are disrespectful to their country and veterans. Freedom of speech works both ways.

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