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Carrying off-duty in NYC

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  • #31
    Originally posted by tanksoldier View Post

    Probably not.

    Every time state law changes, somebody has to decide how that change interacts with LEOSA... usually by arresting somebody.

    The prevailing opinion seems to be that since LEOSA doesn't address magazine capacity state law prevails.

    Since there doesn't seem to have been a test case yet, you can either play it safe or risk being that test case... and you won't successfully sue anybody or own anything, because the principle hasn't been established yet.
    It has been clearly established. LEOSA states that qualified LEOs can carry any type of ammunition type that they want. It's simply the fact that LEOSA never addresses magazine capacity is why it reverts back to whatever state law says is the limit. Anyone qualified under LEOSA can carry hollow points (or any other round) to their hearts content anywhere they are legally permitted to carry a firearm.

    It's a Monell and/or Harris case in the least if a PD tries to jam you up over carrying hollow points.

    EDIT: if you're on-duty and out-of-state, you can carry any magazine capacity you want.
    Last edited by TheTick; 07-29-2022, 02:04 PM.
    If by chance an honest man like yourself should make enemies, then they would become my enemies.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by CCCSD View Post

      Utter typical BS.
      Which part was "BS"? Which part was "typical" of me?

      Maybe you don't have to deal with this often, but it has been a significant issue in somewhat recent history here. The NJ AG was ignoring several warnings from DOJ, etc that directly told them that NJ officers cannot lock up properly LEOSA-qualified individuals from out-of-state, PA specifically. There were numerous issues of NJSP detaining and/or arresting PA officers who were carrying hollow points even after it was repeatedly explained that this was an illegal detention. I got detained once at a shore point boardwalk and given the nth-degree even after they took the time to properly verify me (I had absolutely no issue with them verifying me). It's when it continued and a particular officer kept talking to me wrong and treating me like **** in front of my family that I asked him if he had any addition RS to detain me and once he said no, I told him to **** off then. *** I do not blame NJSP or any other LE agency as a whole *** Their AG office was way out of line and telling NJ cops that they either did not need to comply with that section of LEOSA or were failing to properly instruct NJ police agencies.

      It is a Canton vs Harris (failure to train/ deliberate indifference toward a right) or Monell vs Dep of Soc Ser (violation of a clearly established right).

      It's the same for cops that are still detaining people for filming them and then it all goes down hill from there. Its Harris and Monell claims being successfully brought.

      I've been a cop for 20 years and I work the trenches (by choice) and I love patrol and SWAT. I've never jammed anyone up for non-sense, whether it be a crook or one of my guys. but, I expect guys to be professionals. It is what it is at this point. Again, if you arrest me for carrying hollow points... there's going to be a huge problem. I'm not going to scream or fight, but I'm going to explain LEOSA and that the arrest is a violation of it. Continue with the arrest and your agency either failed to properly train you and/or you are showing deliberate indifference toward LEOSA. It's so far beyond common knowledge of working cops to know what LEOSA does or does not allow an officer to do.
      If by chance an honest man like yourself should make enemies, then they would become my enemies.

      Comment


      • Levithane
        Levithane commented
        Editing a comment
        His point was, you can make a stink about it, try taking them to court and they'll probably just laugh in your face. Its well known certain states don't give a poop about federal laws and guidelines. Dont be a test case, avoid all those states where they have all these problems.

        Point is you know the state you're talking about is wrong, they know they're wrong but they don't care.

      • TheTick
        TheTick commented
        Editing a comment
        Gotcha... but there in lies the problem. I will stand up. They can laugh all they want, the insurance company is going to pay up.

        I'm not going to avoid carrying HST because of the possibility that someone in a state I'm visiting doesn't know the law. I'm not carrying a less-effective, more-dangerous for the public round like FMJ just because someone doesn't feel like staying current on the law.

        Sorry, I'm not carrying a j-frame loaded with wad-cutters for anyone.

        I know you're not telling me to, but when has this tribe of people become the ones to shy away from doing what is right just because it may turn into a hassle. **** and no...

        I'll say it again: LEOSA qualified people have to mind magazine capacity while off-duty but absolutely, positively can carry any type of ammunition in their heater that they desire. That's it and GWB signed it into law **** knows how long ago. Did cops get a 20-year reprieve from being bound to Tennessee vs Garner and not launching heat-seekers and folks fleeing from property crimes? Nope.

      • Levithane
        Levithane commented
        Editing a comment
        See I agree with your sentiments. My only thing is I have no doubts some of the states mentioned on here, specifically the one you mentioned would just put you through a kangaroo court process. I'm only saying this because egregious prosecution has happened in states like NY, against civilians who were abiding with federal law when it came to transporting firearms. John stossel reported on this happening. I'm sure there's a lovely DA who foams at the mouth with the idea prosecuting an out of state cop, or federal SA because they got caught with hollow points or some other violation of a state law, that under LEOSA would otherwise permit you.

        The other members of this site are correct, its better to just let some of these locations eat themselves.

    • #33
      Kind of late to the discussion here, but I'm seriously wondering why anyone might want to spend any amount of time in these shyte-holes. If you have kids or grandkids In these godforsaken places, that might be one thing. Otherwise, let Darwin sort them out.

      Comment


      • Aidokea
        Aidokea commented
        Editing a comment
        Amen......

      • TheTick
        TheTick commented
        Editing a comment
        Because my family has a shore house.

    • #34
      Originally posted by BNWS View Post
      I wonder how the trip went.....
      Haha it went well! I ended up not bringing my piece because I road in Amtrak and I couldn’t carry apparently.

      Comment


      • orlandofed5-0
        orlandofed5-0 commented
        Editing a comment
        I don't know how you "road" Amtrak since Amtrak is on rails but you can ride Amtrak and carry a firearm. I do it pretty often between Philly, NYC and DC.

    • #35
      And there you have it,…….

      Comment


      • #36
        Originally posted by jjpatt92 View Post

        Haha it went well! I ended up not bringing my piece because I road in Amtrak and I couldn’t carry apparently.
        Did you get to experience any of the fun local activities?

        Some favorites are in-front-of-subway-pushing, broad-daylight-raping, unprovoked-sucker-punching, random-people-stabbing, racial-hate-criming, in-public-****ing, poop-smearing...

        Comment


        • #37
          Originally posted by not.in.MY.town View Post

          Did you get to experience any of the fun local activities?

          Some favorites are in-front-of-subway-pushing, broad-daylight-raping, unprovoked-sucker-punching, random-people-stabbing, racial-hate-criming, in-public-****ing, poop-smearing...
          The weed food trucks on every corner was a nice touch. And the monks in Times Square who kept saying namaste. They pretty much had their hand in my pocket reaching for my wallet as they put a beaded bracelet on my wife.

          Comment


          • #38
            Experienced pick pockets are AWESOME.

            Many years ago, sightseeing with friends, we came across an honest one legally hustling on the street, with his show. He was sure to let someone in the immediate friend crowd, in on what he was going to to.

            While distracting me, with pressure on my closed fist, and distracting talk of the magic trick he was doing, he managed to remove my watch, with his thumb and forefinger,…..I felt nothing, pretty cool!

            Comment

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