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So...How's it feel when CNN says you can't shoot?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by detsarg
    At the last firearms class I took about 2 months ago the instructor quoted a study that indicated the national average of shots fired by LEOs in the line of duty only hit their intended target 17% of the time.
    That's why we carry at least two extra mags on our belts.


    Just kidding.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by SgtCHP
      "... in gunfighting with actual criminals, the average police officer effectiveness is at the level of 17% proficiency. .."

      http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/205/205lect02a.htm

      The above information comes from training material called "POLICE GUNFIGHTING" (see link).

      Practice and training are insufficient in today's agencies and the mindset of the individuals involved is oft-times swayed by the fight/flight response.

      .
      We have recently (last couple of years) changed our training tactics to more of a "gunfighting" type of training modeled after what CHP had gone to. I don't have the stats, but according to the person doing our training (who used to teach firearms at CHP) CHP has improved their hit ratio dramatically in the last few years. Its not perfect, but it sure beats the old training of standing online and shooting in a perfect stance because its not realistic of what happens in the streets.

      There are recent articles about the use of laser sights. I have switched to a Crimson Trace lasergrip on my Sig 9mm. I have been impressed with the sights and the information provided by departments using the grips is pretty impressive. Most departments have been reporting 90+% hit ratios for officers using the laser sights. They dont list the detailed information on the website, but when our Rangemaster looked into this equipment they provided each departments ratios with and without the laser sights.

      http://www.crimsontrace.com/default.asp?id=600

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      • #18
        I hear that 83.7 % of statistics are made up on the spot.
        "The statements and opinions contained in this communication do not necessarily reflect the official position of the Commission regarding these issues."
        ____________________________________
        http://www.danielfaulkner.com
        Justice for Officer Daniel Faulkner
        ____________________________________
        09/11/2001 Never Forget

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        • #19
          Cnn

          Two things. One. Paula Zahn is an airhead. Two.Thankfully, CNN doesn't write the shooting policy for LE agencies.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Operator13 View Post
            I hear that 83.7 % of statistics are made up on the spot.

            That is only half true but I'm not saying which half.
            Fear not the armed citizen but rather the government that tries to disarm him.

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            • #21
              Maybe we should turn in our guns, and just give everyone hugs. All I know is that we are in serious trouble if Hilary gets in office.
              ""Liberals are liberal until something happens to them or someone they love, then they want the rules to change"

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              • #22
                Like so many other armchair quarterbacking done to LE; I'd like to see Paula or anyone else like her go out there and do the job of any LE anywhere, even for just one shift. They'd learn to suck eggs real fast.

                One thing a lot of folks on both sides of the fence tend to forget; nothing can train you to be ready for the physical and psychological effects being in an honest to god firefight can do to you, and I for one do not expect accuracy in any situation such as that. We shoot paper targets, F.A.T.S. simulators, "fun houses', and so much more to try to aquaint us to real life situations, but even that falls short of the mark.

                In the years I wore a tin, both LE and Security, I only had to fire once in the line of duty- at a skunk! I got him, too. Put a 9mm 115 gr Silvertip right up his tailpipe, and it was not a pretty sight. However, I always knew one thing; that skunk wasn't going to shoot back at me, at least not with a gun!

                Funny; in a lot of shootings involving LE, doesn't it seem that the accurate shots are the accidental ones? Those always hit something they shouldn't.
                Never make a drummer mad- we beat things for a living!

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                • #23
                  I go to the range as often as I can afford it. Its not cheap, and ammo is going up in price. Still, I want to get to the point were even when under stress I can hit the target consistantly. I guess I figure that if I do it enough it will become automatic. As with all of us, I am sure, I work with some people who only go to shoot when it is time to qualify. They can't even manipulate their weapon to clear a jam or load it quickly. I would deffinately feel more confident about myself in a high stress situation that I would about them. I also practice getting my gun out of the holster so that it becomes automatic. Like everything else, practice practice practice. Why you wouldn't be proficient in something that could save your life is beyond me.
                  "Life is not about how hard you can hit, it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving foward"- Rocky Balboa

                  Black Labs Matter!

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by The Rabbi View Post
                    It doesn't help that current doctrine in many places is to "empty the mag" or "shoot to the ground." Granted, I dont know a specific dept that teaches it, but it is prevalent at the shooting schools so only a matter of time before it makes its way into police training.
                    Incidentally, my understanding is that when police switched from revolvers to semis the hit ratio went up.
                    Then you have no business trying to imply that it may affect police shootings. Not trying to pick a fight here, but that is NOT what is being taught in training. Shoot til that threat is gone. Empty the mag? Sure, give me one bit of proof that it is trained anywhere in police circles.
                    Space for rent .........

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