Police Chief fired over "racist" remark

[dkiefner]

This one hits kinda near home. Opinion in this neck of the woods is >90% against this firing.
http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/12/19/pol....ap/index.html

St Petersburg, FL Chief Mack Vines fired for saying that the mode of a suspect's resistance to arrest was like an orangutan. Local black community leaders said that Vines' apology was not enough, and that he needed firing. SP Mayor then does the firing, based upon "performance issues" from the Chief's three months on the job.

Anybody have a comment on this issue?

[WHC166]

Sounds like they were just looking for a reason to can him....

[nickg]

oh brother...give me a break!

PC Bull$#!t at it's finest! maybe he should have referred to him as "a fine outstanding person who was just trying to escape the man who was bringing him down." there, doesn't that sound much better than calling him the Piece of S*** that he is??

[Niteshift]

Mack Vines used to be the Chief of medium size dept. in my county (just used it as a stepping stone).

I think this is a bunch of BS, but Mack should have know better in St. Pete. That place is a bastion of liberalism and the relations between the police and black community there is terrible.

Like I said, IMHO, it's BS, but it doesn't suprise me about St. Pete at all.

[Gubmentcheez]

Originally posted by dkiefner:
Anybody have a comment on this issue?

I think people are overly sensative. Heck, I wouldn't have gotten upset if he had stated, "...resisting like a big headed drunken potato farmer."

I have a question, what happened to the Chief he was replacing?

[jpa]

They caved to public opinion, people who were entirely too sensitive to absolutely nothing. Mayor needs to grow some spine. Now if he called the guy a porch monkey jigaboo darkie, I'd see a problem.

[txinvestigator1]

Another example of the left wing.

I have called many people from all races monkeys, donkeys, orangutans etc, .

Sorry to start this, but blacks in this country will never have equality if the black leaders and organizations don't quit acting this way.

Mack should sue.

Good Grief!

[DMS 525]

I probably would have said chimpanzee.

Cripes, he meant it as he said it; that is something an ape would do, race not being the issue. What I would like to say is, if the shoe fits...........

[Mike Tx]

Originally posted by txinvestigator1:

Mack should sue.

He probably will. I hope he wins big. I'd like to ask one of those people, "So you think your a monkey?"

[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: MikeTx ]

[SpecOpsWarrior]

Ok what happend to Goliath Davis?

Sounds like I should be glad I didnt take the job there!! I was close to taking the job but something told me not to go to work for an agency that placed recruiting literature in a Hardees! I reasoned that if they were that hard up for help something must be seriously wrong!

Sounds like the chief got screwed, he needs to sue.

[wonderwoman]

I am so sick of this crap. But they got to blame someone because for sure it wasn't the criminals fault for his criminal actions!

[pups72]

Well here it is again, come on folks that was very inappropiate for a Chief of Police to say. Why would he make referance to a human being an animal or acting like an animal. It is no secret that Black Males have been refered to as "Monkeys" historically in this country, so why would he being a police executive even make a comment like that. I guess that i am some what offend by the support that you guys are displaying for this unprofessional conduct by a Chief Of Police. Part of being culturally diversified is being careful not to say things that are offensive to others, i,e Polish Jokes, Hispanic Jokes, etc. If people would take the time to learn about folks who are not like themselves, then we would all not have to address these type of problems. If we lived in a perfect world then that would be the case, but we do not live in a perfect world. I ask how mant times have you heard or told a Racial Joke and thought it was funny???? as Law Enforcement Officers i understand that we are part of our home enviroment and that if we are raised up in an enviroment that condones racism, then by putting on this badge and taking an oath does not make these beliefs magically disappear. However we are representives of ladie justice , who wears a blindfold which represents that she sees no color, so that she may be fair and impartial. I challenge each of you to self-examine yourselfs and and treat people the way you would want to be treated. Stay Safe

[dkiefner]

Hey Pups, I think we can all agree that the remark was probably inappropriate, and it would have been much safer and correct to refer to him as an educationally-challenged, substance-dependent, lesser primate.

I think the problem lies in the city's disproportionate response. The guy apologized publicly, but that wasn't enough for the local activists. Spare me.

[Dinosaur]

I can see where some people would choose to be highly offended by the Chief's remark. Not because it was patently offensive and a racial slur, but rather because it could easily be made to appear so. It served someone's agenda to make the accusation and the Chief unfortunately became its pawn.

I don't know the man or his personal beliefs. I did read the article that outlined the offenders actions during the arrest. If those actions were related to me by the arresting officers, I might easily conjure up an animal analogy to describe the suspect's behavior and to justify the need for my officer's use of force. Unless the chief has clearly demonstrated a history of prejudicial behavior, his words may very well have been innocent of racially demeaning intent. He should be granted the benefit of the doubt.

Based on what I see, the actual victim of prejudice in this case is the Chief. The reason the mayor, and whomever is able to exert pressure on political opinion, can make this accusation seem credible is because it conforms to popular misconceptions based on stereotypes about police. Little regard has been given to what the accusation may do to the man's life and career. He's been permanently and unfairly branded a racist based on all too scant evidence.

Given the present climate of racial oversensitivity, providing any non-prejudicial rationale to the occurrence is itself a risky proposition, likely to result in a charge of racism against anyone making such an argument.

I don't see a solution to the problem. Wish I did. I do know that the thought of becoming the "ball" in some political game like this scares me more than any of the other commonly perceived risks of police work.

[goodgirl]

I had to actually read the explainations of why it was a "racist" remark to even vaguely understand how it was racist. The problem I have is that even though there are some that believe that "It is no secret that Black Males have been refered to as "Monkeys" historically in this country" for those of us that do not use terms like that on a regular basis or expose ourselves to people that would use that expression it isn't as obvious.

I am aware of the expression but only after being reminded of it here and I wouldn't consider it if I heard it in the context of a regular conversation.

I am all for being sensitive to racial issues but honestly sometimes I am thrown for a loop by some of these things. How an off the cuff remark such as this one could be assumed to be racist is beyond me.

I am with Dinosaur on this one when he said "Unless the chief has clearly demonstrated a history of prejudicial behavior, his words may very well have been innocent of racially demeaning intent. He should be granted the benefit of the doubt."

[ 12-20-2001: Message edited by: goodgirl ]