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Keep The Military Out of the Police

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  • Niteshift
    replied
    Moving this mess to Various Topics.

    Leave a comment:


  • retired
    replied
    Patrick,

    Originally posted by PatrickM98:


    The NG does nothing? And just what vast military or law enforcement experience do you have that justifies this statement? You put down the Guard and their role at the airports while having ABSOLUTELY NO CLUE as to what their job is at the airports.

    It's fine to have opinions on topics, but at least get the facts straight first and learn who does what.

    I know quite a few Guard members, several who were activated at airports these past few months since 9/11. These people worked 12 hour shifts, taking time out from their normal lives in order to attempt to ease the public's fears and make airports safer.

    Then someone like you comes along and says that they're a waste of tax money (do you even pay taxes??) and that they could only stop a "wannabe terrorist." You have some nerve.

    [ 07-24-2002: Message edited by: PatrickM98 ]
    While I have nothing against the NG, I agree that their prescence at the airports was a waste of their time, and the taxpayers money.

    What did the "show of force" accomplish? My personal opinion is that the entire reaction to 911 was an overreaction. We have airports that are similiar to East Germany with the security. Hell, we have had more abortion clinic bombings in the U.S. then any Mid-Eastern Muslim terrorists bombings in the U.S.

    Anyway, that is just my humble opinion.

    Leave a comment:


  • Delta_V
    replied
    Originally posted by fpde279:

    The NG doesent deter anything, except for the wannabe terrorist. If i was Al Quada or something i could give a damn. Still People get shot, molested, and terrorist still pass through airports.
    The NG does nothing? And just what vast military or law enforcement experience do you have that justifies this statement? You put down the Guard and their role at the airports while having ABSOLUTELY NO CLUE as to what their job is at the airports.

    It's fine to have opinions on topics, but at least get the facts straight first and learn who does what.

    I know quite a few Guard members, several who were activated at airports these past few months since 9/11. These people worked 12 hour shifts, taking time out from their normal lives in order to attempt to ease the public's fears and make airports safer.

    Then someone like you comes along and says that they're a waste of tax money (do you even pay taxes??) and that they could only stop a "wannabe terrorist." You have some nerve.

    [ 07-24-2002: Message edited by: PatrickM98 ]

    Leave a comment:


  • dkiefner
    replied
    Actually, you started this thread, and dragged the Guard into it long before Mac said anything about Ulster.

    If it has nothing to do with the NG, then why do you continually mention them? The only thing you are really proving is a lack of knowledge about the Guard.

    Leave a comment:


  • fpde279
    replied
    Listen, to clarify what i said, i was a making a refrence to what was going on in Ulster, to what is going on in the US. and how thoes situations differ.

    The NG doesent deter anything, except for the wannabe terrorist. If i was Al Quada or something i could give a damn. Still People get shot, molested, and terrorist still pass through airports.

    But this argument really has nothing to do with the NG.. I could care less, they don't do anything at the airports, so im not worred about that. Im worried about Military presence on US soil in everyday LE

    Leave a comment:


  • JKT
    replied
    Originally posted by fpde279:
    <snip>.....

    Since the Military is not trained in policeing its own citizens, putting them to police on US soil, will mean troubel and conflict between the Police and the Military.
    Hmmmmm, okaaaay.

    Originally posted by fpde279:
    I didn't say there was a conflict between the Military and the people. There WILL be if they are given more power.

    I think someone needs to think things through a little more.


    Originally posted by fpde279:

    As for bag checking, then what the hell does the NG do at the airports. Waste my tax dollars, for nothing????.

    As JarHead stated: the Reservists/National Guard are there to augment the police force already in place. As a show of force to deter problems.

    This tend to keep those that are up to no good in check.

    Leave a comment:


  • dkiefner
    replied
    Wasting your tax dollars??? Oh right, you must pay their salaries.

    Just what is your issue with the NG?

    Leave a comment:


  • jarhead6073
    replied
    fpde,

    Reread your post and my post. You did say that "Hopw ever this is a conflict between the US military and the US people". And I told you the the reservists were in airports as a show of force. A deterent against gunmen and the like. Was it wasting tax dollars? Maybe. I don't know.

    Leave a comment:


  • fpde279
    replied
    I didn't say there was a conflict between the Military and the people. There WILL be if they are given more power.

    As for bag checking, then what the hell does the NG do at the airports. Waste my tax dollars, for nothing????

    Leave a comment:


  • jarhead6073
    replied
    Originally posted by fpde279:
    Well, i would then have to ask what the NG is doing at airports. And that thus proves that the military does not work with law enforcement, otherwise theyu would be helping check bags.

    I don't see cops checking bags either. Matter of fact, I haven't seen any cops in the airports. The reservists (they're not all NG) are there for something called "show of force". Not to check bags, or people's shoes.

    Hopw ever this is a conflict between the US military and the US people.
    There is no conflict between the US military and the US people.

    Leave a comment:


  • dkiefner
    replied
    >>>Well, i would then have to ask what the NG is doing at airports. And that thus proves that the military does not work with law enforcement, otherwise theyu would be helping check bags.<<<

    LE doesn't check bags either - this job is currently performed by contract security firms, who will be replaced by federal screeners this year.

    I'm not certain how you arrive at your conclusions, but the NG presence really proves nothing of the sort.

    Leave a comment:


  • HCP-TX
    replied
    Incrementalism or slippery slope, call it what you like, you end up with the same outcome--a police state with no constitutional guarantees. The whole of the US legal system works on the idea of precedence. Once established, law-makers and activist jurist take precedence an expand it to conform to their ideological agenda. Give an inch, they'll take a mile. When this happens, Joe Six Pack always ends up on the short end of the stick. Posse Comitatis should not be tampered with. I has served us well since 1878 and will continue to do so during this time of the Phony War on Terrorism.

    Leave a comment:


  • fpde279
    replied
    Kirch,
    Not to incite a riot here but i think you are contadicting yourself. This is not a if this then that argument. As i stated and you restated, it is a simple observation.

    Since the Military is not trained in policeing its own citizens, putting them to police on US soil, will mean troubel and conflict between the Police and the Military.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bill R
    replied
    kirch:
    My point is that, no matter what you're arguing, you can't say that one action's result will automatically lead to another action
    kirch, you're overlooking a very key point. I agree you can't say the action in and of itself leads to another action. However when there is a predetermined agenda, by allowing the first action you are losing ground. The Normandy invasion in and of itself did not determine that Germany would lose the war. However with the predetermined agenda the invasion caused the Germans to lose important ground in the war. Wihout gaining that ground the Allies could not have defeated Germany. It is the same thing with our rights. If we surrender ground(rights) it makes it easier for more rights to be lost. If you look at history you will see that it is human nature and the nature of governments to become controling and trample individual rights. So there is a predetermined agenda.

    Leave a comment:


  • kirch
    replied
    I'm not trying to draw anyone into an argument on the second amendment or gun rights. Those are topics that have been debated ad nauseum by people much smarter than me.

    My point is that, no matter what you're arguing, you can't say that one action's result will automatically lead to another action -- there are just too many variables. Sure, you can look back and say this led to that which led to to this, etc., but you can do that for anything. For example:
    My last car broke down so I looked for a new car.
    Because I was looking for a new car, I called a dealer friend of mine.
    Because I called my dealer friend, he asked me what I was looking for.
    Because I told him what I was looking for, he found a green SUV that fit my needs.
    Because the green SUV fit my needs, I bought it.

    So, according the the "slippery slope" argument, the next time I need a new car, I'm getting a green SUV.

    Ludicrous, right? But that's the same predictive logic used when you say that, because "the military is not trained in policeing [sic] there [sic] own people" that "having the military in American Cities will inhibit local state and federal from prosecuting and investigating crimes and criminals."

    Leave a comment:

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