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The anatomy of a gunfight - The Newhall Incident

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  • The anatomy of a gunfight - The Newhall Incident

    Edited to reflect old links being removed.

    The author who did the original presentation of the incident in 2005 may be rehosting it again on another site.

    I'll update when I have the info.

    http://www.gunbattle.us/
    Last edited by Mitchell_in_CT; 03-24-2010, 05:28 PM.

  • #2
    Mitch, thank you. In case yoou didn't know the Newhall Incident is one of the most famous shoot-outs in police history & as far as I know is still brought up in Academy training. What you may not know is that as a result of this very incident many, if not all Dept.'s changed their policy about shotgun storage & reloading practices as (I was told) the offs. were found to have done too many things at the scene as they had done in training which is obviously quite different. Hopefully your post will give some newer offs. something to think about & remind us old guys of a few things.

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    • #3
      Isn't this the incident in which one of the officers was found to have a handfull of empty brass in his hand? (because in training he was not allowed to dump the empties on the ground)
      An impressionable child in a tumultuous world, and they say I'm at a difficult stage... --Meat Loaf

      Professional Stupidity Recognition Technician

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      • #4
        This was it! CHP also had seal on the shotguns thta wasn't supposed to be broken & if it was some sort of report had to be done. All that changed after this.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by hemicop
          Mitch, thank you. In case yoou didn't know the Newhall Incident is one of the most famous shoot-outs in police history & as far as I know is still brought up in Academy training. What you may not know is that as a result of this very incident many, if not all Dept.'s changed their policy about shotgun storage & reloading practices as (I was told) the offs. were found to have done too many things at the scene as they had done in training which is obviously quite different. Hopefully your post will give some newer offs. something to think about & remind us old guys of a few things.

          No problem.

          Old...yeah...hitting 30 must be tough...

          RE: Training habits - this was the incident were an officer had the brass in his pockets when he died because he had done it that way at the range becaue they didn't want to have to sweep up brass after practice?

          Civilians can learn from the past just like the police, and its a dam shame that training rarely improves unless people die from a lack of progress.

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          • #6
            Thanks for the post, I learned about that in the Academy about 3 years ago and almost forgot about it.
            John D. MacDonald, "The early bird who catches the worm works for someone who comes in late and owns the worm farm."

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            • #7
              Let the author know what you think and when his book comes out, buy it.
              Last edited by Mitchell_in_CT; 11-04-2005, 12:47 PM.

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              • #8
                That was the craziest and most interesting thing I have seen in a long time. I had never heard of this incident before. Thanx for the link. And thank all of the officers that serve and protect us each day. This link made me appreciate your service to us even more.

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                • #9
                  A CHP Lieutenant wrote a book about this incident and had a photo section. One photo showed several of the CHP officers laying dead on gurneys in a hospital ER. I have never seen such a sad photo.

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                  • #10
                    We discussed this incident along with the Miami FBI shootout,and the Trooper mark Coates shooting in the firearms portion of the Academy back in the day.Things like these really stick in your mind.
                    FILL YOUR HANDS!!!

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                    • #11
                      Back in '93, when I went academy, lots of wheel gun tactics were discussed, and the instructors told us to pocket our brass if in cover (Where else would I be?) as back in the day the savvy criminal was tuned to carry out a rush assault when he heard brass hit the ground.
                      Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

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                      • #12
                        It hasn't been promoted yet, but on December 13th Officer.com will be presenting a webcast by Massad Ayoob that discusses the Newhall Incident and other "Lessons Learned from the Early Days." Watch the home page of the web site for registration details.
                        Tim Dees, now writing as a plain old forum member, his superpowers lost to an encounter with gold kryptonite.

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                        • #13
                          Bump up to the top for people to see.

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                          • #14
                            Wow, that literally gave me the chills. I remember seeing a something about a stop in Minnesota. I think it may have been Minneapolis where an officer was gunned down at a traffic stop and policy was changed after that. I will see if I can find anything.

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                            • #15
                              I just spent the last 25 minutes looking for that officer and I couldint find it. I found one that may have been him but I am not sure it was the story I was thinking about. The story that I found talked more about the policy of having a single officer in the car in high crime areas then it did the actual stop tactics.

                              http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:...ller+Sr.&hl=en

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