LAPD Finally Gets Smart re: Chases

[Frank Booth]

[ 04-04-2003, 08:45 PM: Message edited by: Frank Booth ]

[Underdog]

I'm not sure that it is the smart thing to do but it will certainly cut down on law suits. Going beyond what Chief Bratton has proposed, the president of the Los Angeles Police Commission seems to think that police officers should only pursue felony suspects.

Unfortunately, it seems that people will now be free to flee when the police attempt to make a stop for a traffic violation. Since officers rarely get a good view of the driver of a moving vehicle, the odds are that most of these incidents would never result in prosecution.

In my opinion, traffic laws are pointless if the police don't have authority to inforce them.

[ 12-17-2002, 10:35 PM: Message edited by: Underdog ]

[p01ic3m4n]

quote:

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Originally posted by Underdog:

In my opinion, traffic laws are pointless if the police don't have authority to enforce them.

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sometimes, in order to protect life and property, we have to let a few things slide.

[LeeRoy]

quote:

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Originally posted by Underdog:
I'm not sure that it is the smart thing to do but it will certainly cut down on law suits.

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I think this is more of a politically based decision rather than a liability based one. The Supreme Court case out of Sacramento (can't remember the name of the parties) pretty much said we can't be sued federally when a pursued party strikes a third party. I'm not sure whether the case decision covers state lawsuits also though.

I can't wait for the vehicular deathray to be perfected. Point it at the pursuing car and melt the f*#$^r down to the ground

[Chiefy_Brown]

Underdog, you're so right m8

how can POLICE be the enforcer of the LAW, when offenders can fail to comply with red traffic lights/other traffic signs in full view of the police and have no fear of being pursued by POLICE for this ??

I can tell you that a MAJOR part of NIGHT DUTY at my station, is STOPPING such offenders for minor traffic violations, defective lights, speeding, red light violation etc. and THEN "oh your breath smells of drink MR." THEN a breath test "oh you're over the limit - you're under arrest for drink-drive"

if these idiots have no fear of being pursued, then they are free to drink-drive AND/OR commit traffic violations to their heart's content

drink-drive is a BIG PROBLEM in the UK, we have tons of arrests for this all the time, MAINLY THROUGH the stopping of vehicles for minor traffic law contraventions

in the UK there is NO RESTRICTION anywhere on POLICE CAR PURSUITS

any POLICE CAR can initiate and maintain a POLICE PURSUIT, only being required to "yield" to "ADVANCED DRIVERS," who are posted to the faster "AREA CARS" and "TRAFFIC POLICE" motors, when they catch up and "take over" the chase

so what if LAPD is top of the police pursuit league ? the offenders brought to book, SHOULD BE dealt with SEVERELY AT COURT, putting the blame on POLICE is as usual the EASY WAY OUT

[ateamer]

Bring back Daryl Gates.

[SpecOpsWarrior]

quote:

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Originally posted by ateamer:
Bring back Daryl Gates.

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AMEN! Preach on brother ateamer!

I'd be filling out an LAPD app if that happend!

[Badgerland]

quote:

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Originally posted by Chiefy_Brown:
if these idiots have no fear of being pursued, then they are free to drink-drive AND/OR commit traffic violations to their heart's content

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I'll have to respectfully disagree with you here. I work for an agency with a "violent felony only" pursuit policy. The public knows about it, because it has been aired on the local talk radio show. In over 2 years, we haven't seen any increase in the amount of people trying to run from us since we put the policy in effect.

[D. Harper]

It would seem that the people that are going to run are going to do so regardless of the department's policy on chases.

[That Guy]

[QUOTE] I'll have to respectfully disagree with you here. I work for an agency with a "violent felony only" pursuit policy. The public knows about it, because it has been aired on the local talk radio show. In over 2 years, we haven't seen any increase in the amount of people trying to run from us since we put the policy in effect.

Maybe in nice sunny WI. Since are policy change it is just about a nightly occurence that people flee. And if we find the car later all we can do is hook them. We justed stared a policy for hooking cars were the driver's are DWLR/S/C. Word gets around and people don't stop. Not to mention the soon to be enforced Prof. of Insur. Law.
But I agree a compromise must me made because it sends out the wrong message.

TG

[drunkhunter]

I think that a lot of the chases go overboard, and I also think that officers should balance the KNOWN violation versus the danger of the pursuit. Afterall, what's more dangerous, an equipment violation or a high speed chase.

I know someone will bring up the argument that we don't know why they are running, but I will point out that I said KNOWN violations.

I'm a couple of weeks away from 4 years on the job, and I have only had one person flee from me. I broke it off quickly. We nailed him later, and he got more time for the fleeing charge than he would have gotten for the DUI that he got away with that night.

[Chiefy_Brown]

well I say Police Officers should be free to PURSUE ALL offenders no matter what

there should NO restrictions on an officer's decision, to pursue an offender

the whole argument should be CENTRED and FOCUSED on bringing the vehicle pursuit successfully to a halt, with the offender under arrest as soon as possible

all possible units should be involved and available to do this, helicopters, traffic, dog units, the whole kaboodle

failing to stop for police ITSELF should be a serious CRIME! WHY ISN'T IT? What a farce !

we are actually SAYING that people will be allowed to drive off from POLICE and the POLICE are to turn off right and say "oh never mind" ? It has come to this ? What a laugh !

[Bob A]

I'll have to respectfully disagree with you here. I work for an agency with a "violent felony only" pursuit policy. The public knows about it, because it has been aired on the local talk radio show.

In small town America, this policy might be useful. In large metropolitan areas, you're inviting people to run.

In over 2 years, we haven't seen any increase in the amount of people trying to run from us since we put the policy in effect.

Just curious, how many pursuits overall are there in your region? I don't recall ever hearing about a rash of car chases there. I'm not saying people don't run, but there are probably more people in LA than in your whole state.

Also, these people know they get on TV, which is probably why a lot of them run. They get their 15 minutes. I'd like to see a much more aggressive stance by police. All officers need to be trained in rolling road blocks and pit maneuvers, as well as stationary techniques. Video cameras in all patrol units can ease fears of litigation, some of which will happen no matter what the police do.

I left LE a little over a year ago because I was tired of having my *** reamed over enforcing the law. Our SO was more concerned with keeping the sheriff in office than LE. Let police be police.

[Shaky & Blue]

quote:

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Originally posted by Samuel:
Yeah, it's always the cops' fault...

Biased POS media...

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Most of us POS media do NOT think it's the cops fault. Most of us think it's the fault of the idiots who run. At the same time, it's hard not to point out on air that the idiots wouldn't run if they weren't being chased.

The majority of us POS media would prefer that you be able to apprehend suspects. Believe it or not, most of us understand that the people in question are probably not running because they ran a red light, but because they have warrants, or drugs in the car, or something else going against them. However, we would prefer that the apprehension NOT involve the death of a little girl or an infant having its arm torn off. We don't think it's your fault this happens; we just see a possible way for it NOT to happen, and we report it.

If you were involved in a pursuit that resulted in the death of a child, wouldn't it haunt you to know that, had you not pursued, the child would have lived?

I like the idea of using police choppers to track a traffic violator so that he can be stopped elsewhere without the need for a chase, although I realize that the cost of operating aircraft will probably make that unreasonable. What you really need is that electromagnetic pulse gun they had in the last season of Miami Vice. Point it at a vehicle and fire, and it disables the electrical system, causing the car to stop.

[lone ranger]

That's great if you live in LA where they have access to Air Support. What about those of us that work out in the sticks.

Every hospital no matter how small seems to have it's own medivac chopper but there are only about 5 or 6 PSP helicopters. Guess that's why a visit to the doctor is so expensive.

Any way. Anybody know where my department could pick up one of those Predator RPV's cheap?

I seem to recall a Discovery channel program that said the British were working on some type of electromagnetic stopstick. It looked sort of promising.