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CCW/Carry: Best example to tell an Anti-Gunner - Road Rage

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  • CCW/Carry: Best example to tell an Anti-Gunner - Road Rage

    .

    I think most of us who CCW/Open Carry do it for mainly one reason: Because you never know what could happen and you want to be prepared to protect your life or someone else's.



    However, when you tell someone who is anti-gun or someone who is asking about CCW/Open Carry you tell them this and they go, "O, Woodbury, that's such a safe place, no crime happens there, you don't need to carry a gun there."


    Well, it may in fact be a low violent crime rate area, but that doesn't mean things don't or can't happen there.



    Still, they go on with how it's not necessary.




    Well, I found the best answer IMHO to explain CCW/Open Carry to someone who doesn't do it:


    "ROAD RAGE"




    Simply put, Road Rage can happen anywhere and anytime, and most likely everyone who has ever driven or been in a car has seen it or had it happen to them. They realize that it is in fact quite a distinct possibly that it could happen to them or someone they know because they've seen it first hand.


    Tell them this, imagine you are in driving along peacefully and all of a sudden someone is tailgating everyone and driving unsafely, swerving in and out of the lanes. He appears to be waving his fist at people and cursing. He looks very intimidating. All of a sudden he gets behind you and starts pushing/tailgating you. Well, you can't move over to the slow lane because there are other cars there. This driver is getting aggressive and honking his horn and waiving his fist. Now you pull up to a stop light and cross-traffic is going with their light, so you can't drive forward or go in reverse. You think to yourself, "Is this really happening? This guy is really scaring me, is he a killer, murderer? Is he on drugs? Is he high or drunk?" You look back and the angry driver behind you has gotten out of his car and he is walking to your driver side window with a tire iron in his hand extremely irate and angry........what do you do? Would you want a gun to protect yourself or a cellphone? What do you do if you have your children in your car? Because if it was just yourself you could perhaps open your door and run away, but most good parents wouldn't want to run from there car leaving their children unprotected and in harms way.



    I think "Road Rage" is a great example because it is more realistically possible in many people's minds that it could happen to them rather then a random act of violence because most people have been a victim of or have seen road rage firsthand and they can relate.


    I bet that anyone who posts has an experience with road rage.


    .

  • #2
    I can't ccw but that scenario crossed my mind so I carry pepper spray in the car. This is another good reason not to hug the bumper of the car in front of you at a stop light, always leave some room so you can make a u-turn to get away. That has helped me once at a RR crossing that had malfunctioning gates.
    Last edited by MD11pilot; 05-20-2011, 03:15 PM.
    Life is what you make of it

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    • #3
      Why did you even start this thread?

      Although road rage is a pretty common occurrence, how many ended into a lethal force situation? Once every 10,000 occurrences? That's like me saying you should carry in the woods due to a possible bear attack.

      Any person can come to any forum and give ONE reason why there might be a situation where it's beneficial to have personal protection. I suggest this thread gets closed before it turns into the multiple other threads that go on in circles with no ending..
      Last edited by SgtScott31; 05-20-2011, 03:23 PM.
      I'm 10-8 like a shark in a sea of crime..

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      • #4
        Disregard.
        Last edited by jd08; 05-20-2011, 03:51 PM.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by SgtScott31 View Post
          Why did you even start this thread?

          Although road rage is a pretty common occurrence, how many ended into a lethal force situation? Once every 10,000 occurrences? That's like me saying you should carry in the woods due to a possible bear attack.

          Any person can come to any forum and give ONE reason why there might be a situation where it's beneficial to have personal protection. I suggest this thread gets closed before it turns into the multiple other threads that go on in circles with no ending..


          What?




          Firstly, it is a good thread.



          Secondly, carrying in the woods because of a bear is a very good idea. That's like wearing a seatbelt in a car.




          I think you missed the point of the thread. Because things are a "rarity" that doesn't mean you shouldn't take precautions. I don't even know what to say to your comment.


          Violent crimes are very rare in certain areas, that doesn't mean that someone shouldn't take precautions, because if it happens to that one person, it's a big deal. That's like having your daughter going to a good college with not many sex crimes, and telling her, "Don't worry about walking in pairs, or being aware of your surroundings, this is a good college."


          .
          Last edited by HEDP; 05-20-2011, 03:58 PM.

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          • #6
            double post

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            • #7
              Here's my problem with CCW/OC.

              -The standards for CCW (in my state at least) are ridiculously low. A 4 hour class, 50 rounds at a paper target 7 feet from you, $150 to the state and your good to go. In my opinion, if a citizen wants the ability to CCW they should go through the same process as a Police Cadet. 8 hours of pure classroom, 8 hours of muscle memory and stance work, 24 hours of range time. There also needs to be a more thorough background check and psyche eval. Not only would this process scare away the people that aren't truly concerned with getting a CCW, it would also improve the quality of people that get their CCW. I would like the citizen defending themselves to able to properly defend themselves; and not shoot my family in the process.

              -OC: I'll be honest, theres no reason for someone without a uniform to OC. It may be "quicker" on the draw, but the simple matter of fact is you make yourself a target by OC. Any psycho wanting to shoot the place up will pick you off first, any thug will know to take care of you before robbing a place. It also makes the sheep uncomfortable; and makes 'me' think your compensating for something by having a .44 Mag on your hip.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by irish21 View Post
                Here's my problem with CCW/OC.

                -The standards for CCW (in my state at least) are ridiculously low. A 4 hour class, 50 rounds at a paper target 7 feet from you, $150 to the state and your good to go. In my opinion, if a citizen wants the ability to CCW they should go through the same process as a Police Cadet. 8 hours of pure classroom, 8 hours of muscle memory and stance work, 24 hours of range time. There also needs to be a more thorough background check and psyche eval. Not only would this process scare away the people that aren't truly concerned with getting a CCW, it would also improve the quality of people that get their CCW. I would like the citizen defending themselves to able to properly defend themselves; and not shoot my family in the process.

                -OC: I'll be honest, theres no reason for someone without a uniform to OC. It may be "quicker" on the draw, but the simple matter of fact is you make yourself a target by OC. Any psycho wanting to shoot the place up will pick you off first, any thug will know to take care of you before robbing a place. It also makes the sheep uncomfortable; and makes 'me' think your compensating for something by having a .44 Mag on your hip.


                MN has standards like that and recently got CCW in 2003.


                Critics decried it and stated it would make MN the wild west and there would be blood in the streets.




                After nearly 10 years MN has not become the wild west and CCW has been a huge success.



                Similar to allowing Guns in National Parks.......critics said the same thing.....wild west and bloodshed and that it would be campers having shoot-outs over marshmallows......well, after a year nothing bad has happened, although an armed camper shot a bear that was getting ready to attack them.

                .

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by irish21 View Post
                  Here's my problem with CCW/OC.

                  -The standards for CCW (in my state at least) are ridiculously low. A 4 hour class, 50 rounds at a paper target 7 feet from you, $150 to the state and your good to go. In my opinion, if a citizen wants the ability to CCW they should go through the same process as a Police Cadet. 8 hours of pure classroom, 8 hours of muscle memory and stance work, 24 hours of range time. There also needs to be a more thorough background check and psyche eval. Not only would this process scare away the people that aren't truly concerned with getting a CCW, it would also improve the quality of people that get their CCW. I would like the citizen defending themselves to able to properly defend themselves; and not shoot my family in the process.

                  -OC: I'll be honest, theres no reason for someone without a uniform to OC. It may be "quicker" on the draw, but the simple matter of fact is you make yourself a target by OC. Any psycho wanting to shoot the place up will pick you off first, any thug will know to take care of you before robbing a place. It also makes the sheep uncomfortable; and makes 'me' think your compensating for something by having a .44 Mag on your hip.
                  I agree with this too or at the very least there should be more NRA courses in NY. Some of the closest courses are in CT or just as far away. Luckily my boss runs the pistol league, I'm friends with a retired cop who ran the pistol courses for his LE agency and my boyfriends mom is an NRA instructor. Otherwise, I would be learning it on my own.

                  OC is out of the question in NY and not something I would want. If I get CCW, I wouldn't only because I don't feel the need. However, just because I wouldn't doesn't mean that I would force that opinion or right on someone else in this state. Crime in my area is actually very low and the local cops do a great job, however, if I end up having to drive to the boonies for work by myself, it would be nice to be able to have that protection.




                  World_So_Cold

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                  • #10
                    People with CCW's do quite well overall when the time comes that they need to fire rounds. Some choose lots of supplemental training, some have past military or LEO experience, some do not. Even in states with NO ccw requirements (VT, Alaska. and others) we do not see any rash of incidents that point to a dire need for more training. People apparently do far better as a rule with loaded handguns than they do with motor vehicles.

                    Bill
                    Just pay your dues, and be quiet :-)

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                    • #11
                      Road rage is one of many arguments for carrying, but I'd hardly call it 'the best.' The topic begs uninformed parties to envision rolling gun battles on the highway (it's highly unlikely, but easy to sensationalize it that way) where bullets are flying between moving vehicles. They could further push gunfight statistics or a multitude of police policies that heavily discourage shooting at moving vehicles.

                      Fear is one hell of a motivator.

                      Just food for thought.
                      Last edited by Sgt. Slaughter; 05-21-2011, 12:37 AM.
                      NRA Life Member

                      The police are the public and the public are the police; the police being only members of the public who are paid to give full time attention to duties which are incumbent on every citizen in the interests of community welfare and existence. - Sir Robert Peel

                      Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. - H. L. Mencken

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                      • #12
                        Not for nothin, but...

                        First, I always carry in the forest. We got bears here - big *** grizzlies. Chances of meeting one - slim. Chances of surviving an attack -slimmer. Chances ofd surviving an attack unarmed - next to zero.

                        Second, by using your reasoning, cops really shouldn't carry either, because the chances are very slim we'd ever have to shoot anyone, right?

                        I went an entire career and never shot anyone, so I guess I was overcautious and just totin around steel for the excercise, right?

                        I never had to cap one off but I was ready. And I am ready now. Why?

                        Because I carry a gun. Always. Sometimes concealed, sometimes open. Not because I am a retired cop - but because I will not be a victim. Nor will my wife or sons - all of whom carry 24/7

                        Next?


                        Originally posted by SgtScott31 View Post
                        Why did you even start this thread

                        Although road rage is a pretty common occurrence, how many ended into a lethal force situation? Once every 10,000 occurrences? That's like me saying you should carry in the woods due to a possible bear attack.

                        Any person can come to any forum and give ONE reason why there might be a situation where it's beneficial to have personal protection. I suggest this thread gets closed before it turns into the multiple other threads that go on in circles with no ending..
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 1042 Trooper View Post
                          Not for nothin, but...

                          First, I always carry in the forest. We got bears here - big *** grizzlies. Chances of meeting one - slim. Chances of surviving an attack -slimmer. Chances ofd surviving an attack unarmed - next to zero.

                          Second, by using your reasoning, cops really shouldn't carry either, because the chances are very slim we'd ever have to shoot anyone, right?

                          I went an entire career and never shot anyone, so I guess I was overcautious and just totin around steel for the excercise, right?

                          I never had to cap one off but I was ready. And I am ready now. Why?

                          Because I carry a gun. Always. Sometimes concealed, sometimes open. Not because I am a retired cop - but because I will not be a victim. Nor will my wife or sons - all of whom carry 24/7

                          Next?



                          +1


                          .

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                          • #14
                            I'm just not sure why a new thread was started about "another reason to carry a gun" when there's been a recent rash of open/concealed carry threads lately. Maybe they're unrelated, but it's sort of a no-brainer thread. If you want to carry, that's your perrogative, whether you're worried about road rage incidents, robberies, or giant grizzly bears.
                            I'm 10-8 like a shark in a sea of crime..

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by HEDP View Post
                              However, when you tell someone who is anti-gun or someone who is asking about CCW/Open Carry you tell them this and they go, "O, Woodbury, that's such a safe place, no crime happens there, you don't need to carry a gun there."
                              I usually just compare my gun to a fire extinguisher: It's very rare you'll have a fire in your kitchen, but no one thinks it's odd to have a fire extinguisher just in case, and no one would say you shouldn't have one. It's a tool for protection in the event of a situation that may call for it.
                              "Of course America had often been discovered before Columbus, but it had always been hushed up."

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