Are Cops Intimidating the Victim?

[jellybean40]

I've been looking for a link to the story, but i cant find one.

You all know how much i support cops, and that i'm also a woman. so i've been following this story as much as i can. I havent seen LBomb or Dino or other Philly cops on here much lately, but maybe they can comment too.

An "exotic dancer" in Philly has accused two cops of "giving her a ride in the patrol car" from a store, and then proceeding to both rape her in the back seat. If it's true, it's terrible. And now other women are coming forward to complain about the two cops, one young girl (16, i think) said that one had commented on her breasts before while she was walking down the street.

The thing i have a question about, is what happened at a hearing where the rape victim was testifying. Many police came in uniform (i think 50 or 60, but like i said i cant find a link). The judge was very unhappy and forced them all to sign a paper and give their name and badge number. The Police Commissioner said that if any of them came in uniform and were not on duty, they would be disciplined. He also said that if they came there while on-duty, they were also in violation. Do you feel they were trying to intimidate her, or just show some support for their own? The guys interviewed said they went "out of curiousity."

Let me add that the victim, who has been interviewed extensively on TV (in shadow so you cant see her face), says she feels they WERE trying to intimidate her, and that it did make her afraid and afraid to leave her home.

[ 02-05-2003, 06:59 PM: Message edited by: jellybean40 ]

[Oregon Mike]

I think it's safe to give the cops the benefit of the doubt. It's possible the rape actually happened, I have no doubt that that kind of thing does happen occasionally. On the other hand, I also have no doubt that there are a lot of people that would falsely accuse police for their own personal gain.

The officers that went to the hearing know the accused better than any of us, and are therefore better judges of their characters. I think if the accused officers seemed "shady" to their coworkers, they wouldn't be getting this kind of support. As for violating policy, those officers knew what they were doing and will have to live with the consequences. If their colleauges are being falsely accused, I'm sure it'll be worth it to them.

Mike

[spaz]

google is your friend.

the article (graphic).

[Mike Tx]

I wonder if it's safe to give the alleged victim the benefit of the doubt? Why form an opinion of guilt or innocence based on occupation?

[spaz]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Tx:
Why form an opinion of guilt or innocence based on occupation?

---

what about drug dealers?

[Frank Booth]

[ 04-04-2003, 09:15 PM: Message edited by: Frank Booth ]

[jellybean40]

Thanks for the link.

I havent judged anybody guilty or innocent of the rape. The one cop's lawyer said the sex was consentual... which is still wrong since it happened in the squad car, on duty, and he's a married guy... but not a crime.

My problem with the whole thing was that courtroom $hit. i agree with Frank (i know...worlds are colliding ) I think they should be allowed in the courtroom to show their support without getting crap about it.

[Mr.Orange]

If it turns out to be true that they had sex with her, not rape but sex, then they should be suspended.

This is one huge reason not to have sex in a patrol car while on duty. Some badge bunny might want to get it on while you're on duty, something goes wrong and BAM its now rape and you're fawked.

As for the uniform in the court issue, maybe its me, but a brother officer cant show support for another officer? I would have an issue with signing in, if it had never been done before.

I will say that these two officers are a pair of D.A.'es.

[Sig220Man]

Personally, I see nothing wrong with officers coming to the courthouse in uniform to support one of their own who's being accused, or to be there for the trial of someone who hurt or killed one of their own. You often will see this at the sentencing of cop killers.

Of course, this could cause problems if this was not a department-approved event. When you wear the uniform, you represent your department, so the department has the right to determine when and where you can wear it. Of course the department has no say so over what you do on your off-duty time, in your civilian clothes, as long as you don't violate any laws in the process.

I do have a problem with the judge forcing the officers to sign in, if he didn't make the entire audience do so. Like Frank Booth said, unless he declared those proceedings closed to the public, those officers have every right to be in the audience as long as they don't disrupt the proceedings.

[Frank Booth]

[ 04-04-2003, 09:16 PM: Message edited by: Frank Booth ]

[Chief Wiggum]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Tx:
I wonder if it's safe to give the alleged victim the benefit of the doubt? Why form an opinion of guilt or innocence based on occupation?

---

Actually, we all should presume the cops are innocent. Innocent until proven guility remember.

[Sig220Man]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frank Booth:
I buy my own uniforms. When they want to tell me where I can wear them, they can start paying for them. If I want to stop off at court either on the way to work or the way home from work that's my bidness. There is nothing in my Rules and Regs that say I have to change for work at the police station, or come right to work from home.

---

Well then Frank your department is in the minority. I've never heard of a department that either doesn't have a specific policy regarding uniform wear, or at least won't address it under a generic "Conduct Unbecoming" policy.

Let's take this further: What if you decided to go into a bar off-duty, but in uniform, and decided to have a drink.? No gun or any other offensive weapons on you, nor will you be operating a motor vehicle. No conduct that would be frowned upon if you were in civilian clothes. Are you telling me that under your department's Rules and Reg's that's perfectly acceptable behavior? I'd like to see that happen

[flyfisherman674]

As my Chief would say (and a few of my old Sergeants in the Army), "We're here to preserve democracy not practice it."

Seemed alot more believable when I was enlisted in Uncle Sam's Army. Not so much now in the years that I've been reclassified as a private citizen with actual civil rights

:-)

- Pat

[Frank Booth]

[ 04-04-2003, 09:16 PM: Message edited by: Frank Booth ]

[Sig220Man]

Read my post again Frank...I asked you if your department would allow you to sit and have drinks at a barwhile off duty but in uniform. Based upon what you say about your department's policy, this should be permissible, which again I find very difficult to believe.