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  • Drug wars worry some Americans

    MEXICO CITY — Indiscriminate kidnappings. Nearly daily beheadings. Gangs that mock and kill government agents.

    This isn’t Iraq or Pakistan. It’s Mexico, which the U.S. government and a growing number of experts say is becoming one of the world’s biggest security risks.

    The prospect that America’s southern neighbor could melt into lawlessness provides an unexpected challenge to Barack Obama’s new government. In its latest report anticipating possible global security risks, the U.S. Joint Forces Command lumps Mexico and Pakistan together as being at risk of a “rapid and sudden collapse.”

    “The Mexican possibility may seem less likely, but the government, its politicians, police and judicial infrastructure are all under sustained assault and pressure by criminal gangs and drug cartels,” the command said in the report published Nov. 25.

    “How that internal conflict turns out over the next several years will have a major impact on the stability of the Mexican state.”

    Retiring CIA chief Michael Hayden told reporters on Friday that Mexico could rank alongside Iran as a challenge for Obama — perhaps a greater problem than Iraq.

    The U.S. Justice Department said last month that Mexican gangs are the “biggest organized crime threat to the United States.” National security adviser Stephen Hadley said last week that the worsening violence threatens Mexico’s very democracy.

    Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff recently told The New York Times he ordered additional border security plans to be drawn up this summer as kidnappings and killings spilled into the U.S.

    The alarm is spreading to the private sector as well. Mexico, Latin America’s second biggest economy and the United States’ third biggest oil supplier, is one of the top 10 global risks for 2009 identified by the Eurasia Group, a New York-based consulting firm.

    Mexico is brushing aside the U.S. concerns, with Interior Secretary Fernando Gomez-Mont saying Wednesday: “It seems inappropriate to me that you would call Mexico a security risk. There are problems in Mexico that are being dealt with, that we can continue to deal with, and that’s what we are doing.”

    Still, Obama faces a dramatic turnaround compared with the last time a new U.S. president moved into the White House. When George W. Bush was elected in 2000, the nation of 110 million had just chosen Vicente Fox as president in its fairest election ever, had ended 71 years of one-party rule and was looking forward to a stable, democratic future.

    Fox signaled readiness to take on the drug cartels, but plunged them into a power vacuum by arresting their leaders, and gangs have been battling each other for territory ever since.

    Felipe Calderon, who succeeded Fox in 2006, immediately sent troops across the country to try to regain control. But soldiers and police are outgunned and outnumbered, and cartels have responded with unprecedented violence.

    Mob murders doubled from 2007, taking more than 5,300 lives last year. The border cities of Juarez and Tijuana wake up each morning to find streets littered with mutilated, often headless bodies. Some victims are dumped outside schools. Most are just wrapped in a cheap blanket and tossed into an empty lot.

    Many bodies go unclaimed because relatives are too afraid to come forward. Most killings go unsolved.

    Warring cartels still control vast sections of Mexico, despite Calderon’s two-year crackdown, and have spawned an all-pervasive culture of violence. No one is immune.

    Businesses have closed because they can’t afford to pay monthly extortion fees to local thugs. The rich have fled to the U.S. to avoid one of the world’s highest kidnapping rates. Many won’t leave their homes at night.

    The government has launched an intensive housecleaning effort after high-level security officials were accused of being on the take from the Sinaloa cartel. And several soldiers fighting the gangs were kidnapped, beheaded and dumped in southern Mexico last month with the warning: “For every one of mine that you kill, I will kill 10.”

    But the U.S. government is extremely supportive of the Mexican president, recently handing over $400 million in anti-drug aid. Obama met briefly with Calderon in Washington last week and promised to fight the illegal flow south of U.S. weapons that arm the Mexican cartels.

    While fewer Americans are willing to drive across the border for margaritas and handicrafts, visitors are still flocking to other parts of Mexico. And the economy seems harder hit by the global crisis than by the growing violence.

    The grim assessments from north of the border got wide play in the Mexican media but came as no surprise to people here. Many said the solution lies in getting the U.S. to give more help and let in more migrant workers who might otherwise turn to the drug trade to make a living.

    Otherwise the drug wars will spill ever more heavily into America, said Manuel Infante, an architect. “There is a wave of barbarity that is heading toward the U.S.,” he said. “We are an uncomfortable neighbor.”
    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/World/6217903.html
    ‘Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go.’
    Oscar Wilde

  • #2
    Personally, I'm more than a little curious as to why the Mexican government hasnt been bombing the crap out of the houses where the cartel leaders live.........if these guys dont meet the definition of 'terrorist' I dont know what does.......
    The posts on this forum by this poster are of his personal opinion, and his personal opinion alone

    "Politicians are like diapers. They need to be changed often and for the same reason"

    "We fight not for glory; nor for wealth; nor honor, but only and alone we fight for freedom, which no good man surrenders but with his life"

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    • #3
      because the mexican gov. has been bought by them.
      ‘Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go.’
      Oscar Wilde

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by texaschickeee View Post
        because the mexican gov. has been bought by them.
        Already knew that one......one of several reasons why they are likely to implode sometime in the near future.....

        Which will leave us to mop the floor with the cartel leaders......not that Obambi will likely do anything of the sort.....
        The posts on this forum by this poster are of his personal opinion, and his personal opinion alone

        "Politicians are like diapers. They need to be changed often and for the same reason"

        "We fight not for glory; nor for wealth; nor honor, but only and alone we fight for freedom, which no good man surrenders but with his life"

        Comment


        • #5
          There is a very simple way to stop the drug violence: All Americans should stop using illegal drugs. Then there would be no market for the product, and no reason to fight over who gets to make and sell it.

          So I conclude that American drug users are responsible for the drug violence.
          Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
          Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by USMCEvan
            Seriously, if we went to war with Mexico, I would probably join back up. This crap is too close to home to just let somebody else fight it. The day war breaks out with them, I will be in the recruiters office to sign those papers again.
            If we went to war with Mexico, then more Mexicans would come to the US. If we conquered it, Mexico might even become part of the US. What would we do then?
            Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
            Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

            Comment


            • #7
              There is no war on drugs, in a war people are killed not sent to excercise prison.

              When it gets bad enough that we are tired of it, we can just do Israeli air strike on the locations just like they are doing against Hamas, that's a war.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by jb5722
                good, i hope Obama responds by authorizing DEA or ICE to hire thousands of new agents, and begin military strikes against cartel targets in mexico.
                Why is it Mexico's fault that we have an insatiable demand for drugs? Isn't that our fault?

                As long as there is a demand, there will be a supply.

                Following your logic, Mexico would bomb the US because we manufacture most of the guns that illegally find there way to Mexico.
                Last edited by DAL; 01-18-2009, 04:17 PM.
                Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
                Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

                Comment


                • #9
                  Meanwhile some states are releasing drug offenders and giving tickets instead of jail time. We stopped sending cases state after a guy with 700+ pounds of marijuana got probation.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jb5722
                    good, i hope Obama responds by authorizing DEA or ICE to hire thousands of new agents, and begin military strikes against cartel targets in mexico.
                    Like that would really happen.
                    ‘Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go.’
                    Oscar Wilde

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by madchiken View Post
                      Meanwhile some states are releasing drug offenders and giving tickets instead of jail time. We stopped sending cases state after a guy with 700+ pounds of marijuana got probation.
                      I can just hear the judge... but it was just some weed.....not like coke or something.
                      I hear that.
                      ‘Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go.’
                      Oscar Wilde

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        In the end, market forces are more powerful than governments. Market forces more than anything else are responsible for the collapse of communism in the Soviet Union and the continuing erosion of communism in China.

                        How many countries should the US be at war with because we are unable to convince our populace not to use drugs?

                        Originally posted by jb5722
                        secondly, your second statement assumes that the US and mexico are of equal power. they're not. we are much stronger than them
                        Ah yes, the time-dishonored argument that might makes right. So, it's OK for whoever is most powerful to wipe out whoever is not. If that is so, the US will not last much longer.

                        Originally posted by jb5722
                        secondly, using your example, since mexico has a problem with illegal firearms coming from the US, we should eliminate the demand for them.
                        No, under my argument, Mexico, not the US, should eliminate the demand for the weapons.

                        Originally posted by jb5722
                        look at what happened in the 80's in Miami, the president responded to the problem of massive violence caused by narcotics and other illegal drug dealers by instituting a massive recruitment drive for both local police and the DEA.
                        We can't even hire enough qualified federal agents as it is. Moreover, the problems we are having today shows that hiring a bunch of DEA agents was not very successful.

                        If the only way that we can reduce drug consumption is to wage war against other nations, then we should give up. We could eliminate Mexican drug wars by legalizing drugs. Our government could even manufacture them and sell them at a profit. Then we would not have to expend our limited resources waging war against other countries so that our misguided citizens won't be able to indulge in vice. And I think it is pretty obvious that if we stamp out drug cartels in one country, they will pop up in another.
                        Last edited by DAL; 01-18-2009, 05:28 PM.
                        Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
                        Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by David Hineline View Post
                          There is no war on drugs, in a war people are killed not sent to excercise prison.
                          That's why it shouldnt be called a war on drugs.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            lots of officers die every year fighting this war...yes, people die in this war...not just go to prison
                            Perseverate In Pugna

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Narco View Post
                              lots of officers die every year fighting this war...yes, people die in this war...not just go to prison
                              +1

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