Are women police able to cope?

[Artie]

This was an article in the South Australian newspaper the Sunday Mail.
http://www.news.com.au/common/story_...5E2746,00.html

Any comments?

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We are the Police! Resistance is Futile!

[copitsweet]

Artie, Artie, Artie!

You should know better, you diplomat you. If I didn't know better, I would think that you were being deliberately provocative again.

Comments like that from the bench are not uncommon these days - for both male and female officers. Perhaps if these officers had done the verbal judo training, they may not have had to pinch this bloke at all.

It certainly sounds to me like they lost it!

Originally posted by Artie:
This was an article in the South Australian newspaper the Sunday Mail.
http://www.news.com.au/common/story_...5E2746,00.html

Any comments?

[Artie]

Its interesting, isn't it. I wait to see what the SA Commissioner has to say.

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We are the Police! Resistance is Futile!

[Don]

Sounds to me like a politically well connected person got drunk and stupid. Got what was coming to him, and then used his connections to have it white washed.

Happens all over the world, and who ends up being the "bad guy" the cops of course.

If the judges involved could see the idiot at time of arrest, instead of cleaned up, wearing a suit and looking angelic, they just might have a different idea.

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SHOOT LOW SHERIFF, they

[WannaBeCopper]

I believe that men have had years to discover what works for them in difficult situations on the job and has had the training change for them accordingly. Women havent been around as police officers as long as men have. Men and women both have strengths and weaknesses and they have to compensate for these in a different way. Maybe we should look at creating different training for men and women in specific areas.

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As the snow started to fall, he pulled his coat tighter around himself. Too tight, as it turned out. "This is the fourth coat crushing this year," said the police sergeant as he outlined the body with a special pencil that writes in the snow.

[This message has been edited by WannaBeCopper (edited 06-03-2001).]

[This message has been edited by WannaBeCopper (edited 06-03-2001).]

[Artie]

At the moment, there are probably a 40/60 ratio of women to men as police at St Marys. Some of the police women are little petite things that if the wind blew hard enough they would blow away. However they are as tenatious as any male I have worked with. On the other hand, there are some police men I have met who are quite gentle in their manner.

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We are the Police! Resistance is Futile!

[Don]

Originally posted by Artie:
On the other hand, there are some police men I have met who are quite gentle in their manner.

I always thought that was the idea. Be gentle until it is time to quit being gentle. Then take care of business!

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SHOOT LOW SHERIFF, they

[SpecOpsWarrior]

Copit thanks for the opinion, but as usual I think you are way off base in your opinions.

"Perhaps if these officers had done the verbal judo training, they may not have had to pinch this bloke at all."

I think we both read the same article that was posted in this thread, so how do you get the idea that these two officers could have used verbal judo to avoid this situation?

I will be honest and say that the only verbal judo training class I have had was a 2 hour inservice training class where we learned to say "Sir I understand what your saying and I respect that, but your still going to jail" so maybe I am missing the whole verbal judo craze. I do know that when I took that verbal judo class I was told that verbal judo was only another way to attempt to generate voluntary compliance, if a suspect doesnt respond to the verbal judo then you gain compliance through other means.

Just maybe this guy did not respond to the first attempt at verbal judo and these two officers decided he needed to be hooked up, I dont know about you but I am not gonna beg a belligerent subject to comply with my orders, if he doesnt than I do what I was trained to do, to date my training has not let me down, verbal judo has.

"It certainly sounds to me like they lost it!"

Why is that, because one of the officers said she was frightened of the suspect?

I was always taught that fear was a motivator, if your afraid your about to be shot, you shoot first, if your afraid your about to be attacked you attack first. Maybe these officers dont have that instinct, but that does not mean they "lost it"!

I thought the same thing Don did, a politically well connected guy used his influence to pull his *** off of the hot seat. Instead of the blame falling on him for acting like an idiot and trying to fight with women, the blame fell on the cops.



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[email protected]

[SpecOpsWarrior]

Ok now that my rant is over with I'm gonna offer an opinion on women as police officers.

I believe that society needs a police force that resembles all of its members. We need women police officers, I dont think we could efficently police our society without them.

Now as far as working with female police officers go, to me its not the plumbing that matters its the ability that counts. If a woman can handle herself than she has every right to wear the badge, if she cant then she needs to get a job that she can handle. The same goes for the guys I work with, if they cant do the job then get out. All I want is to work with someone who is gonna do their job each and every day, whether it be a man or a woman makes absolutely no difference to me.

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[email protected]

[This message has been edited by SpecOpsWarrior (edited 06-03-2001).]

[Artie]

I think what the article is really saying is are women able to perform just as effectively as men in the policing role, given their naturally slighter build. I am what is called a dinosaur. I have been brought up in the era where police were generally males, and huge. The bigger the better. If you talked back to a police officer, you got what was coming to you. The Police were a FORCE. The public got the type of policing that the Police Force believed it needed. There really was not a role in the Police for women, other than that of school traffic duties or reluctantly, duties relating to sexual offences. Policewoman had to be just as big and burly as the men. I remember that many of the policewomen were described as looking like upturned treetrunks. Nowadays, the Police deliver a SERVICE, where we strive to ensure that the customer, the community and victims, are provided with a policing service that they require. More and more women are joining the Service. They bring with them a different style of policing. Gone are the days of crash, bang, in the back of the van. Nowadays, men and women have to undertake courses in sociology, communication, and conflict resolution, to name a few, before they finally are permitted to call themselves police. I am seeing more and more women looking towards policing as a stepping stone in their life. Many of them bring communication and a softness that at times can confuse the largest, angriest offender into submission. On the other hand, some of them, like many of the males joining now, do not have the communication skills that they need. But with time, will be able to improve to, in the end, become very good police officers.

What am I trying to say. There is a role in the police service for both males and females. Males traditionally bring with them outer strength and with that confidence in a crowd situation. Females traditionally bring with them an ability to communicate on a different level, often not having to resort to force to difuse situations. I think that this is due to their higher education standards and their natural nurturing skills.

They are here to stay. They may even take over the whole of the Police Service in NSW, just as one from NSW has done in Victoria.

One good thing, I will put forward is that they no longer look like upside down tree trunks.

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We are the Police! Resistance is Futile!

[copitsweet]

Spot on mate! Nothing more needs to be said.

Originally posted by SpecOpsWarrior:
Ok now that my rant is over with I'm gonna offer an opinion on women as police officers.

I believe that society needs a police force that resembles all of its members. We need women police officers, I dont think we could efficently police our society without them.

Now as far as working with female police officers go, to me its not the plumbing that matters its the ability that counts. If a woman can handle herself than she has every right to wear the badge, if she cant then she needs to get a job that she can handle. The same goes for the guys I work with, if they cant do the job then get out. All I want is to work with someone who is gonna do their job each and every day, whether it be a man or a woman makes absolutely no difference to me.

[PeteBroccolo]

I don't think anyone, male or female, should be totally fearless in this line of work, otherwise they will end up dead some day.
Sounds like the Judge went beyond what needed to be said.
We just have to bear in mind the continuum of force:
- the law is in place and people will abide by the law generally;
- Peace Officers are present and by their presence will convince people to abide by the law;
- Peace Officers sometimes have to verbally remind people to obey the law in order to maintain the peace;
- Peace Officers may have to physically get between people to restore the peace;
- Peace Officers often have to use strong verbal commands to restore peace;
- Peace Officers may have to use unarmed physical force to restore the peace;
- Peace Officers often have to use low-level force weapons (handcuffs, chemical, impact) to prevent or stop breaches of the peace;
- a Peace Officer may finally have to resort to a level of force (unarmed or armed) that is necessary to stop a person from committing an act that may cause grievous bodily harm to, or the death, of one or more other persons, and force that is required to be used may be so severe that the person may not survive, but the necessary later inquiries prove the level of force was justified;
and that at any time we, as PO/LEO, must remember that we can escalate, or, more importantly, de-escalate, to the level of force as is required for the situation. Anything less is unprofessional.

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P. D. (Pete) Broccolo, Constable
#32936 - RCMP Weyburn, Saskatchewan

[unhappycop]

Whilst working as an FTO I had the misfortune to work with two females probationary constables in a row, both of whom who were right MUPPETs (Most Useless Police Person Ever Trained). One ran away and locked herself in the police car, leaving me fighting with a robbery suspect, and the other was just VAGUE (dumb as dogs**t).

That said, I've worked with some ripper women on the job who know how to be caring, warm and fuzzy and still kick ***. I've also worked with some ****-POOR men...