Some thoughts from an patriotic American

[mac90]

I, as a patriotic American citizen can no longer tolerate the amount of un-American
remarks posted on this board. I do not know if this board is American owned or
not, but if it is, I would ask you to start fighting back more than some of you are
doing.

These posters pretend not to understand why Americans must be armed, while at
the same time these hypocrites are themselves armed. These same elitists, in times
of war, will be the first to cry to Americans for help, as their predecessors have done in the past! It has become all to fashionable to attack American values and ideals,and apparently, for some reason, we do not have the ability to recognize this attack, or the ability to stand up to it. I for one do recognize it and stand up to it!

I say to these people, "What part of the world are you in? The part where Americans with guns died fighting to save you, or the part where Americans with guns died kicking your backsides?"

I will no longer sit by and post side by side and be friendly with a foreign national
who attacks the American way of life! America is a great country and has helped
many if not all of these foreign powers in their time of need. But now, when
America is experiencing growing pains they kick us when we are down and spit in
our faces. I say to you cowards and turncoats, if you want this Americans guns,
COME GET THEM!

William M. Sullivan
American.

[dkiefner]

Hmmmm, this oughtta be interesting....

OK mac, we'll let this one have a shot, even though it sounds like a gun control argument in disguise. We'll be watching though.

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Dave Kiefner
[i]Die Wahrheit ist eine Perle. Werfen sie nicht vor die S

[Teton]

mac90,

I can understand your feelings of frustration. I think that there are many of us who have felt the same anti-American sentiments often expressed in this forum, and Americans aren't the only ones who have noticed it. I do have to say however, that one of the cherished freedoms of this country is freedom of speech. Granted there are certain limitations to this right, especially when they impose or infringe upon the rights of others. And with that freedom also comes the responsibility of respecting the fact that others can voice their opinions, whether or not we agree with it.

As far as the issue of Americans not standing up for their country, I believe in some respects that puts us in a crisis, one that could cripple this nation. I grew up a military brat, I also married into it. My grandparents fought and shed blood for this country. I have a very strong love and appreciation for this country, and I enjoy the opportunities I have to show how much I love this country. I think the greater problem is apathy. There are many in this country who choose not to remember the sacrafices made to give them the freedom they enjoy. It troubles me to hear of children, adults and others who refuse to stand at allegiance for the American flag. If we do not remember, embrace and learn from the past, we will lose our future. Too many today are caught up in the daily fight for themselves, to look out for their own. There is a time and place for that, however we must never forget that to succeed we must remember the past and work together to make this country what we want. There are many in this country who share the view you and I do, we just don't hear about it as much. Many have criticized the movie just released "Pearl Harbor," but I, for one, am glad it was made. Even though it may not be completely historically accurate, what a better time for Americans to remember where we came from and the sacrafices that were made. So mac90, I am glad to share America with you and the many others like you.

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"The truth of the matter is that you always know the right thing to do. The hard part is doing it."

[Jessica]

I only have one word for this entire thread...

Amen.



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Indian Creek Hunting Supplies

[interloper]

Mac90, Your frustrations are not unexpected. But, however anyone in any country feels about guns, our country was built on the right of the individual to say what they think. We don't have to agree with them but we do have to tolerate views that are in opposition to our own. I applaud your patriotism and willingness to stand up for what you believe but don't forget that we have to let other people assert their beliefs too as long as it is done in a civil manner.

[THE BRONZE]

I was quite happy when Jessie Helms told the United Nations where to stick it. I agree American Citizens should debate what goes on in the United States, but no foriegn power is going to dictate what we do.

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Happiness is having two Super Sports to choose from.

[Artie]

Mac90,
Don

[Niteshift]

I'm trying to stay out of this one, but I do need to address one comment Artie made:

[i]"I don

[copitsweet]

Artie: Go Bloke!!

Have you noticed who is NOT posting in these topics?? All of the people that we seem to get along with so well.

This small minority of rabid gun-owners bounce all over us when we hint that we disagree with the gun-laws in the US. Mac90 obviously cannot logically debate or gently take the P155 out of someone when it comes to guns. His comments in the "rifle club" topic show that in spades. His comments in starting this post are probably even worse.

It is impossible to have a rational argument with someone who resorts to this type of response.

Didn't your training teach you to humour this type of person?

P.S. He has a gun!!

[Copper2be]

Mac90,

I appreciate that you think us "foreign nationals" are attacking your American values and civil rights. It seems to me that what I and a few other were doing was voicing our OPINION on some American ideology. Canadians and Aussies are never going to be in a position to change your political policies and quite frankly don't want to.

As for forcing yourself to be friendly with us. Sorry, I will still be able to sleep at night regardless.

And as for "kissing your arse" in the other thread...well you just show the level of maturity you are operating at.

For the other Americans who disagreed with myself and others, thank you for allowing me the freedom to debate this topic with you. You remember freedom don't you Mac? It is what your country was founded on.

As Forest Gump said " And that's all I've got to say about that!"

[mac90]

Thanks folks. I voiced my opinion as well, but I guess that's different, huh?

Artie, I never mentioned your name, so if you want to take it personal, I don't know what to say. I will say that I did take up for you on another forum.

As for as the patriots who give me support, thanks very much, as far as the rest of you, we can still talk, just don't tread on me, and 'tolerance' goes both ways. Thanks.

[Copper2be]

Originally posted by mac90:

"these hypocrites" These same "elitists"

I say to these people, "What part of the world are you in? The part where Americans with guns died fighting to save you, or the part where Americans with guns died kicking your backsides?"

I will no longer sit by and post side by side and be friendly with a foreign national
who attacks the American way of life!

I say to you cowards and turncoats, if you want this Americans guns,
COME GET THEM!

William M. Sullivan
American.

Mac90,

Looks more like you just threw around insults to me.

At least the other guys debated the topic and didn't rely on insults.

As for the second part of your statement. I live in Canada. The country that almost burned your white house to the ground during the war of 1812. Also the country that has been one of the FIRST to get involved in international conflicts. Better go reread your history books.

Sorry to all you other yanks. Don't mean to insult you. Just needed to reply one more time.

Since this topic will just further inflame and I may say something that some may not like I will not be posting any further rebuttals to Mac. Why waste your and my time?

[SpecOpsWarrior]

Heres another opinion to throw in to the mix.

Mac, I personally think you owe Artie an apology. I cant say that you were refering to him specifically, but I assumed by your comments that Artie was recieving the brunt of your wrath. Artie has taken on this debate in a friendly manner, he has never resorted to name calling and has acted like an ideal member, he doesnt want your guns, it appears to me that all he wants is a good debate. He is not the enemy here, so take the barricade down from the door and see this whole thing for what it is, a debate.

I honestly feel like this whole thing has been blown way out of proportion, while I dont agree with Artie I know he has the right to express his opinion, as do all the other members of this forum.

Artie, I have told you this before and I think it is necesary to say it again, I like the way you have debated this issue, you have shown intelligence and maturity, keep up the good debate.

A qoute from copitsweet:
"It is impossible to have a rational argument with someone who resorts to this type of response."

Copitsweet does the term "the pot calling the kettle black" mean anything to you?

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[email protected]

[wonderwoman]

These are my thoughts MAC;

I am Canadian first and always. I will defend my country till the day I die if necessary against any military attack.

I lived in Chicago and Evanston for 6 years. I presently live in a border town. I have always thought of the United States as my "sister"!

I was there every moment with "CNN" during the Gulf WAR. When the United States had casualties of War I felt they were also also "OUR" casualties of War and I always thought the same was true visa versa.

I listen to Detroit radio everyday as well as CBC. The United States is part of my history.

Thats doesn't mean that I believe in everything you do and that I don't think we have better ways in some things (and visa-versa) but I can firmly say that I can't imagine the day that I would ever be anti-American!

[THE BRONZE]

At least the other guys debated the topic and didn't rely on insults.

There is at least one exception to this, Copper2be.

As posted by copitsweet,
This small minority of rabid gun-owners bounce all over us when we hint that we disagree with the gun-laws in the US.