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  • #16
    Originally posted by Curt5811 View Post

    It would have had the same result in my state... the Fleeing statute itself specifies a "marked" police vehicle. An unmarked or a UC car wouldn't cut it, even if a uniformed officer was driving. We've even had a couple of ADAs hmm and haw over issuing a fleeing charge when the officer used a fully marked but clean-top patrol car.
    Originally posted by Hagen View Post


    Guess you're not in Connecticut with their marked/unmarked cruisers...

    Don't you have a separate offense such as "failure to stop" or "failure to obey directions of a law enforcement officer", like delzo70 mentioned above?
    In Iowa we have a felony eluding statute that needs to be a marked patrol car with a uniformed officer.

    There are other statutes that can be used for unmarked cars and/or officers directing traffic
    Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

    My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Curt5811 View Post

      It would have had the same result in my state... the Fleeing statute itself specifies a "marked" police vehicle. An unmarked or a UC car wouldn't cut it, even if a uniformed officer was driving. We've even had a couple of ADAs hmm and haw over issuing a fleeing charge when the officer used a fully marked but clean-top patrol car.
      That's a nice specific statute. In my state, the eluding charge includes failure to bring the vehicle to a stop after receiving "any signal" from "any police officer or LEO" to do so. "Any signal" could mean just about anything. And how can a citizen tell if someone's a LEO if they are neither in uniform nor in a marked vehicle? The detective did his best to identify himself as a LEO (while driving), but evidently that wasn't good enough. Oh well.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Hagen View Post
        Don't you have a separate offense such as "failure to stop" or "failure to obey directions of a law enforcement officer", like delzo70 mentioned above?

        Yes, we do. Its one of the three subsections of 346.04. Sub (3) is Fleeing, and is a Class I felony. The penalties for each are obviously much different.


        (1) No person including a personal delivery device operator shall fail or refuse to comply with any lawful order, signal, or direction of a traffic officer.

        (2) No operator of a vehicle shall disobey the instructions of any official traffic sign or signal unless otherwise directed by a traffic officer.

        (2t) No operator of a vehicle, after having received a visible or audible signal to stop his or her vehicle from a traffic officer or marked police vehicle, shall knowingly resist the traffic officer by failing to stop his or her vehicle as promptly as safety reasonably permits.

        (3) No operator of a vehicle, after having received a visual or audible signal from a traffic officer, or marked police vehicle, shall knowingly flee or attempt to elude any traffic officer by willful or wanton disregard of such signal so as to interfere with or endanger the operation of the police vehicle, or the traffic officer or other vehicles or pedestrians, nor shall the operator increase the speed of the operator's vehicle or extinguish the lights of the vehicle in an attempt to elude or flee.
        https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/sta...tutes/346/I/04

        Sub 1 or 2t would cover the Detective situation, although the penalty is only a citation. Even plainclothes Detectives have the authority to enforce traffic law. We also have a criminal Resisting/Obstructing an Officer charge under 946.41, a Class A Misdemeanor

        More than one way to skin a cat.
        You can trust just about every officer you work with to risk their life to save yours, but don't ever leave your lunch in the breakroom refrigerator.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Curt5811 View Post
          Even plainclothes Detectives have the authority to enforce traffic law.
          I heard something like "unmarked units can't enforce traffic laws", but I guess that's not he case in your state, right?

          Wwwhat's a... "personal delivery device", by the way? Could that happen to be a bicycle?

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Hagen View Post

            Wwwhat's a... "personal delivery device", by the way? Could that happen to be a bicycle?
            It could be. The term could also apply to a powered wheelchair or mobility device / scooter. People have been known to drive them on the street illegally from time to time.
            You can trust just about every officer you work with to risk their life to save yours, but don't ever leave your lunch in the breakroom refrigerator.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Curt5811 View Post

              It could be. The term could also apply to a powered wheelchair or mobility device / scooter. People have been known to drive them on the street illegally from time to time.
              Apparently it includes these cool delivery robots:



              http://host.madison.com/ct/business/...7366828e7.html

              Is this how you guys get your cheese curds and beer delivered when it's too cold to leave the house?

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Hagen View Post

                I heard something like "unmarked units can't enforce traffic laws", but I guess that's not he case in your state, right?

                The law varies from state to state
                In Iowa officers in unmarked cars can and FREQUENTLY do enforce traffic laws. My small agency has two unmarked squads.

                The "problem" lies in when a person flees from one of our unmarks...............The felony eluding statute doesn't come into play unless a marked unit manages to join the chase and takes the lead. YEP our deputies/officers in Iowa are taught to let a marked car take over since from that point if the other factors are present ....we can then charge the felony charge
                Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

                My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

                Comment


                • #23
                  Here the "i didn't know they were the police" argument is quite common in courts. Usually, marked or unmarked cars conduct traffic. True "undercover" cars, i.e. narcotics guys cars that have no lights or siren aren't used outside of emergency situations. Unmarked cars have a complete set of lights in them. It isn't just a kojack light. Also, the folks operating them are in a uniform of some type. This reduces the defenses arguments as to why their client ran.

                  We also do a lot of "step out and flag over" traffic enforcement. This involves parking a marked car on the side of the road and stopping vehicles using LIDAR or RADAR or for visible violations. We are always in a uniform though.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by careerchange#2 View Post
                    Here the "i didn't know they were the police" argument is quite common in courts. Usually, marked or unmarked cars conduct traffic. True "undercover" cars, i.e. narcotics guys cars that have no lights or siren aren't used outside of emergency situations. Unmarked cars have a complete set of lights in them. It isn't just a kojack light. Also, the folks operating them are in a uniform of some type. This reduces the defenses arguments as to why their client ran.

                    We also do a lot of "step out and flag over" traffic enforcement. This involves parking a marked car on the side of the road and stopping vehicles using LIDAR or RADAR or for visible violations. We are always in a uniform though.
                    Yep
                    Most civilians don't know the difference between "undercover" and "unmarked" They will use the terms interchangeably. We of course know the difference

                    Our officers do a government funded traffic program called sTep a few times each year & often "flag" offenders over during the program. Of course they are in uniform. NORMALLY one of the unmarked vehicles is the operator of the Radar/Lidar on those fun days....but he is in uniform
                    Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

                    My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by careerchange#2 View Post
                      Here the "i didn't know they were the police" argument is quite common in courts. Usually, marked or unmarked cars conduct traffic. True "undercover" cars, i.e. narcotics guys cars that have no lights or siren aren't used outside of emergency situations. Unmarked cars have a complete set of lights in them. It isn't just a kojack light. Also, the folks operating them are in a uniform of some type. This reduces the defenses arguments as to why their client ran.
                      This is also how my agency does it. We use a mix of fully marked, slick top and unmarked units for traffic enforcement, and all have some type of LED lights and sirens. But in the case I mentioned, our detective was in an unequipped UC vehicle when he observed a hit and run (with serious bodily injury) and attempted to stop the driver. Driver wasn't having it until a marked unit lit him up. Leaving the scene of an accident is only a traffic violation. Eluding would have been a second or third degree felony.

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                      • #26
                        Question in regards to traffic stops. Figured I would ask in a preexisting thread instead of making an new one. Since this is the "ask a cop" section I presume almost all are current or former so with that comes a decent amount of experience. So here is my question ... throughout your careers what is 1 thing you feel could be added to prevent roadside collisions in such instances(during traffic stops)?

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by TUNEDNIMPORTED View Post
                          . throughout your careers what is 1 thing you feel could be added to prevent roadside collisions in such instances(during traffic stops)?
                          Not having to pull violators over.
                          Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

                          My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

                          Comment

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