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Leaving roadway, driving through a parking lot to avoid traffic on roadway (CA ?)

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  • Leaving roadway, driving through a parking lot to avoid traffic on roadway (CA ?)

    I need help with figuring out the CVC, if there is one for this type of incident.

    Driver was traveling Northbound on 12th st and made a left turn onto a dirt road adjacent to 12th st. that turned into a parking lot. Individual drove through the parking lot and made a right turn on F St. which would have been the same street he would have turned onto if he would have continued on 12th st. The driver did this to avoid waiting for appx. 8 cars ahead of him who each had to stop at a stop sign before changing there direction of travel.

    Similar to vehicles who want to avoid a red light and drive through the parking lot of a gas station on the corner and avoid waiting at the red light.

    Thanks for any replies in advance.

  • #2
    I can't think of any VC violation. If they are cutting across private property that is not open to the general public, you might have a technical violation of PC 602(n), but in reality, the District Attorney may laugh you out of his office on that one.
    Going too far is half the pleasure of not getting anywhere

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    • #3
      A long enduring MYTH in CA is that you cannot cut through a parking lot to avoid congestion. There is no state law prohibiting such movement.

      A local community may enact a law to preclude traffic from doing so; or, the property owner may erect signs prohibiting the use of the property under 602 PC, but the owner would have to make the observation, call the police and make a formal complaint. All of that makes it almost useless in its totality.

      I used to just keep an eye on those who cut through private property and make certain they did not do so in violation of 21804 VC - right of way violation when entering the roadway from the property.

      There are far more flagrant violations on the books.
      Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence!

      [George Washington (1732 - 1799)]

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      • #4
        I'm in MD so it wouldn't apply to your case but I'd think there would be something. With the scenario you gave, there would be a couple of possibilities in MD. One would be crossing private property to avoid a traffic control device (ie parking lot, etc). Another one, and would apply to your scenario would be leaving the roadway to avoid a traffic control device.

        I'm surprised in CA that something like this would be legal. I write this ticket at least once a week. We have a few shopping centers that sit on the corner of congested roadways. I've seen cars in one parking lot 8 cars deep in front of the center and 20 or more cars deep behind the shopping center using a seperate exit. After numerous complaints from the businesses, a few of us will go there and right tickets.
        Last edited by Taylor1430; 04-24-2009, 08:28 AM.

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        • #5
          Short cutting prohibited is what we call it, but it is a local city ordinance.
          It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.

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          • #6
            Nothing illegal about the concept you stated, but lots of opportunities for violations conducting the movement such as failure to signal 100 feet prior, unsafe speed crossing the sidewalks, failure to yield to a pedestrian on the sidewalk, right of way violation entering traffic after cutting through, etc.

            Comment


            • #7
              We have 'avoiding a traffic control device', I'd also consider operating on/over shoulder, unsafe exit/entry, fail to maintian lane. We have a nice 'catch all' title disobey traffic control device (lane markings, signs, lights,etc). Not familiar with Calif vtl, I work on the other kooky coast!
              Last edited by Highwaylaw; 04-24-2009, 02:39 PM.
              "The wicked flee when no man pursueth
              but the righteous are bold as a lion"

              Proverbs 28:1, inscription beneath NLEOM lion.sigpic

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              • #8
                The way you described it I don't see a violation in Cali. I've heard of some officers that use illegal passing on the right for the guys that make the right through the gas station, but never tried it myself so your mileage may vary:


                21755. The driver of a motor vehicle may overtake and pass another
                vehicle upon the right only under conditions permitting such movement
                in safety. In no event shall such movement be made by driving off
                the paved or main-traveled portion of the roadway.
                Today's Quote:

                "The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
                Albert Einstein

                Comment


                • #9
                  Remember, our goal as cops is (among other things) to reduce crashes. One of the methods of reducing crashes is to reduce traffic congestion. That's all the short cut folks are doing - reducing congestion by finding an alternate, albeit non-traditional route.

                  You really have to step back for a second and ask yourself -

                  A parking lot that is otherwise open for public use is being used periodically as a shortcut. Unless the driver's conduct is creating a genuine hazard, what's the harm? Is there really a problem here that is worthy of enforcement action?
                  Going too far is half the pleasure of not getting anywhere

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by L-1 View Post
                    Remember, our goal as cops is (among other things) to reduce crashes. One of the methods of reducing crashes is to reduce traffic congestion. That's all the short cut folks are doing - reducing congestion by finding an alternate, albeit non-traditional route.

                    You really have to step back for a second and ask yourself -

                    A parking lot that is otherwise open for public use is being used periodically as a shortcut. Unless the driver's conduct is creating a genuine hazard, what's the harm? Is there really a problem here that is worthy of enforcement action?
                    It's the fact that the driver cut across the on coming lane at a high rate of speed, continued at the speed onto a dirt road then in the parking lot that is used by the firefighters across the st near the fire station. The driver also did not come to a complete stop in the parking lot before proceeding onto F St. He slowed just enough to maintain control of the vehicle while he made his turn.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by MCSD View Post
                      It's the fact that the driver cut across the on coming lane at a high rate of speed, continued at the speed onto a dirt road then in the parking lot that is used by the firefighters across the st near the fire station. The driver also did not come to a complete stop in the parking lot before proceeding onto F St. He slowed just enough to maintain control of the vehicle while he made his turn.
                      Remember, I qualified my comments by saying, "Unless the driver's conduct is creating a genuine hazard..."

                      If there is a genuine hazard, such as failure to yield to oncoming traffic, driving at an unsafe speed for conditions, failure to yield when entering a roadway, etc., then you've already got what you need.

                      OTOH, if he just pis*ed you off because he found a legal way to beat waiting in line for the stop sign, let it go. There's other idiots out there more deserving of hearing your dulcet voice say, "press hard, you making four copies."
                      Going too far is half the pleasure of not getting anywhere

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by L-1 View Post
                        Remember, I qualified my comments by saying, "Unless the driver's conduct is creating a genuine hazard..."

                        If there is a genuine hazard, such as failure to yield to oncoming traffic, driving at an unsafe speed for conditions, failure to yield when entering a roadway, etc., then you've already got what you need.

                        OTOH, if he just pis*ed you off because he found a legal way to beat waiting in line for the stop sign, let it go. There's other idiots out there more deserving of hearing your dulcet voice say, "press hard, you making four copies."
                        I guess I read to fast and missed that part. No I wasn't really concerned about him beating traffic by driving through the parking lot. It was when I was observed him driving at a high rate of speed in the parking lot. I decided to see what he would do next and he drove right onto F St. without stopping or using his turn signal.

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                        • #13
                          In MD they have a charge driving across private property to avoid a traffic control device. $90/1 point
                          John 3:16

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Code Seven
                            You give a new meaning to "Police Sergeant." j/k
                            Come work for the feds and you'll see things are ran a little differently. The pay is nice BTW, thanks for the input

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Code Seven
                              You're welcome. At my department, someone with 1 and 1/2 years of experience is 6 months off probation. I was actually about to congratulate you on making sergeant so early in your career, but I see you slept through a certain class in sergeant's school......
                              Now,now boys, we're all on the same side here, play nice

                              Besides, if Obama can go from never having worked a day in his life to being leader of the free (for now) world, why can't someone else have a meteoric rise to power? After all, this is America (for now).
                              "The wicked flee when no man pursueth
                              but the righteous are bold as a lion"

                              Proverbs 28:1, inscription beneath NLEOM lion.sigpic

                              Comment

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