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  • FTO Program

    I've been hearing that some departments have a harder FTO Program than others and a lot of people don't pass FTO. I was wondering what makes people fail their FTO? What makes some FTOs harder than others?

  • #2
    Originally posted by Reaper08 View Post
    I was wondering what makes people fail their FTO? What makes some FTOs harder than others?
    PPOs not responding to training is the thing that makes them fail. As for one FTO program being harder than others, that is kind of subjective. When a PPO finishes academy and goes into FTO, his training officer outlines certain tasks as well as the method and manner these tasks must be done.

    The training officer observes the PPO and signs off on each task OR recommends remedial training in the tasks he feels the PPO is weak in. In a real-world FTO program, the PPO will go through three training officers.

    If a PPO doesn't meet the standards, they actually fire themselves.

    “Truth is not what you want it to be; it is what it is, and you must bend to its power or live a lie.”

    Miyamoto Musashi

    “Life Is Hard, But It's Harder When You're Stupid”

    George V. Higgins (from The Friends of Eddie Coyle)

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by slamdunc View Post
      PPOs not responding to training is the thing that makes them fail. As for one FTO program being harder than others, that is kind of subjective. When a PPO finishes academy and goes into FTO, his training officer outlines certain tasks as well as the method and manner these tasks must be done.

      The training officer observes the PPO and signs off on each task OR recommends remedial training in the tasks he feels the PPO is weak in. In a real-world FTO program, the PPO will go through three training officers.

      If a PPO doesn't meet the standards, they actually fire themselves.

      Read this 3 or 4 times
      Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

      My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

      Comment


      • #4
        "Some" people don't pass FTO -- not "a lot" of people. It is frequently a failure to respond to training, but some people just have too many policy screw ups as well.

        Comment


        • #5
          I guess I shouldn't say one FTO is harder than the other. I should say that I know more new officers fail one department than another.

          Is this because there are different standards in different departments?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by just joe View Post
            "Some" people don't pass FTO -- not "a lot" of people. It is frequently a failure to respond to training, but some people just have too many policy screw ups as well.
            Policy screw ups as they relate to learning / showing proficiency in assigned tasks?

            “Truth is not what you want it to be; it is what it is, and you must bend to its power or live a lie.”

            Miyamoto Musashi

            “Life Is Hard, But It's Harder When You're Stupid”

            George V. Higgins (from The Friends of Eddie Coyle)

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Reaper08 View Post
              I guess I shouldn't say one FTO is harder than the other. I should say that I know more new officers fail one department than another.

              Is this because there are different standards in different departments?
              Different hiring standards, different standards in learning / teaching tasks or something else???
              Each state has standards for hiring and training officers to a basic level of proficiency. Individual agencies have policies and procedures they expect PPOs to follow. CALEA accredited agencies have a lot of standards that non-accredited agencies do not have; this may or may not be a factor.

              Written tests administered by agencies during the hiring process SHOULD be indicative of the recruits ability to grasp concepts, retain information and put it into play. Reality being what it is, the vetting process can only weed out so many people. The agency does not know the PPOs abilities until they are tested in the field. The training officer has it to do; they must explain and demonstrate tasks to the PPO and they must observe the PPO perform the task consistently.

              Some PPOs (even veteran officers for that matter) don't get it or worse yet, want to do it their way. These people are not well suited to work as an unsupervised police officer.

              “Truth is not what you want it to be; it is what it is, and you must bend to its power or live a lie.”

              Miyamoto Musashi

              “Life Is Hard, But It's Harder When You're Stupid”

              George V. Higgins (from The Friends of Eddie Coyle)

              Comment


              • #8
                Lack of officer safety/common sense. Inability to take their book knowledge and practical app training and apply it to real life scenarios under stress.
                Today's Quote:

                "The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
                Albert Einstein

                Comment


                • #9
                  Like any other occupation, some people go through the hiring and training processes without weeding out but when they are asked to put the training to real world use; they fail. There are varying reasons why they fail, but in the end they did not measure up to the standards expected of them. I do not know of any agency that does not try to help their probationary officers through remedial training, so it is not like FTO is a "one screwup and you're done" environment. Some just cannot cut it on the streets.

                  It happens as much as we try to avoid it. Training officers is an expensive proposition and we do not pull the plug if the problem can be rectified.
                  In God We Trust
                  Everyone else we run local and NCIC

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    All of your information has been really helpful! Thanks for all the responses! I had just heard that a department had a lot of new officers failing FTO so I just wanted to know what it was that makes an officer fail or how they do fail so thank you for all the responses!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by slamdunc View Post
                      Policy screw ups as they relate to learning / showing proficiency in assigned tasks?

                      Could be anything, such as a continual failure to properly complete reports or process evidence, tardiness, insubordination, AWOL from court, inappropriate comments of a sexual nature, etc., etc.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Reaper08 View Post
                        I guess I shouldn't say one FTO is harder than the other. I should say that I know more new officers fail one department than another.

                        Is this because there are different standards in different departments?
                        One local department does not fail anyone from their FTO program, even when the FTOs say they should be released.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Reaper08 View Post
                          All of your information has been really helpful! Thanks for all the responses! I had just heard that a department had a lot of new officers failing FTO so I just wanted to know what it was that makes an officer fail or how they do fail so thank you for all the responses!
                          I guess the final answer is -----YES, some agencies are harder than others in various ways.

                          One local agency near me is "hard" to get hired on. Their hiring standards are some of the the hardest in the state & MANY candidates wash out during the hiring process..............but once hired very few ever leave the agency other than by retirement. That particular agency rarely flunks someone from FTO.

                          Another one also has a reputation of being tough to get on ------yet they frequently discharge people for failure to satisfactorily complete FTO.


                          The thing is that just because you "fail" an FTO program in on agency----it doesn't mean you can't make it through in another agency. I have seen multiple officers who had trouble with one department and excel in another
                          Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

                          My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            For two years prior to my retirement, I was the FTO Supervisor for my unit. I agree with the colleague who noted that the biggest reason recruits fail the program is, and get this. FAILURE TO RESPOND TO TRAINING. I capped this sentence, (shouted at you) for a reason.

                            The program I was involved with documented a recruit's progress on a daily basis (DOR) supplemented by written weekly progress reports written by the FTO. Additionally, the recruit was given a weekly examination which covered each subject of instruction given in the proceeding week.

                            In instances where the recruit was week or difficient, he, she was given remedial training to address the areas where he/she was having trouble. While some FTO programs may be more difficult than others, this is really subjective, and the reader should keep in mind, that an "easy" FTO program is really worse than not having one at all.

                            There should be, and is, a degree of difficulty in ANY good FTO program.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              In my opinion, I would prefer a hard FTO program. Its supposed to train you for the rest of your career. I don't want to just get by. I want to blow it out of the water! But I'll worry about that when I get to it

                              Comment

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