is there any department in the united states that allows for the use of a blackjack?

[How To Police]

so in a previous post i asked if any old time cops ever used a blackjack, i'm curious, is there any law enforcement agency in the united states or it's territories that allows the use of a black jack? how would i find out?

thank you

[CCCSD]

so in a previous post i asked if any old time cops ever used a blackjack, i'm curious, is there any law enforcement agency in the united states or it's territories that allows the use of a black jack? how would i find out?

thank you

Why?

[How To Police]

blackjacks are extremely mysterious weapons, i have never seen a weapon with so little written about it, that is so strongly testified as to it's effectiveness for self defense.

[BNWS]

Go to Blackjack.com and type in "law enforcement" in the search engine.

[Aidokea]

so in a previous post i asked if any old time cops ever used a blackjack, i'm curious, is there any law enforcement agency in the united states or it's territories that allows the use of a black jack? how would i find out?

thank you

How would you find out? By resisting arrest...

[NolaT]

Why?

^^^^^^ this

[just joe]

I guess you could call every agency in the US and its territories.

[NolaT]

Outside of your curiosity, I’d have to say that, No, there aren’t any Depts in the US still actively using Dept issued and trained Blackjacks, or other similar weapons.

Non firearm weapons mostly all fall under the category of defensive weapons for Dept liability. The old school PR24 most certainly does, even the newer style, collapsible batons can still be classified as defensive, although that’s clearly arguably.

I think classifying a Blackjack as even remotely close to being a defensive weapon would be hard, and too much of a liability.

[How To Police]

> I think classifying a Blackjack as even remotely close to being a defensive weapon would be hard, and too much of a liability.

why do you think so?

[NolaT]

PRs were designed to be used as a defensive weapon as well as offensive, incorporating blocks with proper training.

Collapsible batons aren’t really designed to be defensive as PRs, but I guess it could be argued if used in a sword like blocking motion.

Blackjacks are from a totally different era, offensive only,….

[Iowa #1603]

Nola T
I knew the "inventor" of the PR 24. Google Lon Anderson PR24
He was a Park Ranger in the county I later became a deputy in. He got beat up (badly) answering a call for service in 1970------and while recovering from his injuries studied martial arts.
He quickly sold the idea to Monondock but worked for them for decades training

[NolaT]

Cool story, ever hear how much he sold it for?

[Bing_Oh]

I think classifying a Blackjack as even remotely close to being a defensive weapon would be hard, and too much of a liability.

I suppose that depends on how it's used. If they're used as just another impact weapon, and follow the same rules, then I don't see how they would be any different than an expandable baton. Now, if they are used as they were back in the day...well, that's a different story.

On an unrelated note, I'd rather perplexed by the OP's obsession with blackjacks and the like. They're mostly a tool relegated to historical LE and certainly haven't been in wide use in probably 30+ years.

[How To Police]

> On an unrelated note, I'd rather perplexed by the OP's obsession with blackjacks and the like. They're mostly a tool relegated to historical LE and certainly haven't been in wide use in probably 30+ years.

at least on the internet i have seen hundreds of individual testimonies that a blackjack is the most effective less lethal self defense tool ever used by law enforcement, and it's just so strange to me that so little is written down about it.

[CCCSD]

You DO realize that the OP is looking for information for a cause, RIGHT?

The user name gives him away.

[BNWS]

Let him chase his tail.

[CCCSD]

Read the bragging in his other post… Can’t believe guys dime themselves out that easy.

[Bing_Oh]

A "cause" based on an outdated tool mostly known only to the long-retired in LE? Good luck. I'm nearing retirement and have never seen one actually used. I suspect that most officers hired in the last 10+ years have never heard of them or know how they were used if they have.

Whatever cause he may have, he's about 30 years too late.

[CCCSD]

Felonies have long lives, especially if they are against a protected class. Seems cops just can’t shut up…

Enjoy the subpoenas.

[BNWS]

You're right.... Although the UOF I described was deemed justified by my agency, the DA and the courts I have deleted in an effort to derail the troll.

[Bing_Oh]

Felonies have long lives, especially if they are against a protected class. Seems cops just can’t shut up…

Enjoy the subpoenas.

Subpoenas. For vague incidents recounted on a random internet message board that may or may not have happened at some unspecified time in the past, in an unidentified jurisdiction, involving unknown subjects, by someone who may have been an LEO in the past 50 years. With all due respect, CCCSD, your tinfoil hat may be on too tight.

If I were to make a guess, I'd say that it's much more likely the OP's profile that he's a security guard is true and he thinks blackjacks are "cool" and wants one to carry as opposed to him being a secret agent trying to weasel confessions from retired cops online.

[NolaT]

The lack of any distance whatsoever is still the biggest drawback of ever wanting to carry one, even back in the I’d guess.

[Iowa #1603]

The lack of any distance whatsoever is still the biggest drawback of ever wanting to carry one, even back in the I’d guess.

Nope We carried them AND used them (frequently I may add)

Tactics have changed dramatically since the 1970's /1980's when these were being phased out. They were original issue in the 40's/50's and were the primary impact weapon after the billy club.....once again close in weapons. The next escalation was a fire arm.


I carried mine in an appendix position where I could get to it with my "weak" hand. You smacked someone on the forearm and whatever they were carrying OR holding on to (like your partner, your other hand, or a weapon ) was dropped instantly

A smack to the knee or back of the knee and the person was on the ground with virtually no ill effects.. Same with a smack to the outer thigh or shin.

A smack to the side of the head and they went to sleep -------sometimes for longer than you wanted but RARELY a fatal blow especially if it was a slapper and not a lead ball on a spring type billy.

It was fun times in a bar fight in my younger days.......................................

[NolaT]

Ha,….different times for sure.

I remember non collapsible PRs, huge Maglights, speed loaders, grey “brick-like” Motorolas, rotating dash lights, tall square, rotating light bars, and the huge step up from S/W to the 92F, but black jacks were way before me,………

[Iowa #1603]

I started at the prison in 1976........on patrol in 1978

We had DUMP POUCHES,then 12 round Belt Loop holders before Speed loaders and finally mag pouches......

I personally knew Lon Anderson the inventor of the PR24...actually developer for law enforcement because it was originally an Asian rice harvesting tool. He worked as a Park Ranger in my county before he got famous

First qualification was with a S&W Model 10

[Joe2845]

Some uniform trousers came with sap pockets on the right leg as late as the early '80s. I never knew anyone that carried a sap.

[Aidokea]

Mine still had sap pockets behind both legs when I retired in 2019. The youngsters didn't know what they were originally for.

[LA DEP]

Our patrol uniform pants still have sap pockets behind both legs

Saps are also still an authorized impact weapon