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Put yourself in these shoes. What would you do?

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  • Put yourself in these shoes. What would you do?

    I just watched the Virginia cops OC the Army LT video and I want to know what other law enforcement officers would have done. I a 160 pound officer in a very small town. I only have 2 years of experience and I feel that is a drop in the bucket compared to a lot of big CA city cops that have done my entire law enforcement activity in probably a month. Sometimes I am the only officer on in the entire country, which is the second largest county in the entire state (I learned very quickly to pick my battles, in reference to traffic stops, when I'm alone at night). I watched the video and wonder what I would do. The guy failed to yield 1.5 miles with the officers behind with him lights and sirens. They do a felony traffic stop, I would have done that too. By the time I finally got backup (a reserve waking up and coming to my location or a trooper coming from a neighboring county) and we approach the car and the driver won't get out but he has his hands out. This is where I don't know what I would do.

    I have seen so many videos where officers get shot while wrestling to get a guy out of a car. So my thought is I want him to get out of the car by himself. So I can keep my gun on him in case he pops out with a gun. I feel it would be best for me to use OC as well, until it gets to the point he wants to get out of the car. I don't think I would have tazed him. Maybe a backup officer could have broken the passenger window and tazed him while I kept my gun on him? Do you think the officer in the video got fired for deploying the excessive amount of OC?

    Thanks in advance for letting me pick your brains.

  • #2
    I did NOT watch the Virginia video. So I will just go by what you posted, MY agencies guidelines and the fact that you work alone with little back up.
    Any vehicle that does not yield to me is no longer a traffic stop, it is a pursuit and under NYPD guidelines pursuits are prohibited so I will terminate, find a quiet area, write up a report(if needed) and have some coffee. If you follow the rules police work virtually comes to a halt.
    Last edited by BNWS; 04-13-2021, 05:52 AM.

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    • #3
      ..........

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      • #4
        Tactics are not discussed here, as the public (including, potentially, the bad guys) can read this forum just as easily as the LEO's.

        That being said, I would encourage you to run "what if" scenarios through your head as you're driving around. Make sure you're considering your experience, training, equipment, and availability of assistance into the equation. Consider if you would have to do things quickly or if you have time on your side in any given scenario. If you have access to veteran officers, discuss it with them and don't hesitate to poach good ideas and tactics from them.

        And, don't forget your most important tool...communication. As a small-town LEO with minimal backup, communication is particularly important for you. You'll find that, if you're relatively good at it, you can talk the vast majority of people into doing what you want them to do (or a reasonable facsimile thereof)...the rest, you have to do the hard way. The major training point of the scenario you're referring to is considering whether the second officer escalated too quickly and if there was the potential for a verbal resolution. Sometimes there isn't and you have to work the puzzle another way, but you have to consider all the tools in your toolbox.
        "He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
        -Friedrich Nietzsche

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Bing_Oh View Post
          Tactics are not discussed here, as the public (including, potentially, the bad guys) can read this forum just as easily as the LEO's.

          That being said, I would encourage you to run "what if" scenarios through your head as you're driving around. Make sure you're considering your experience, training, equipment, and availability of assistance into the equation. Consider if you would have to do things quickly or if you have time on your side in any given scenario. If you have access to veteran officers, discuss it with them and don't hesitate to poach good ideas and tactics from them.

          And, don't forget your most important tool...communication. As a small-town LEO with minimal backup, communication is particularly important for you. You'll find that, if you're relatively good at it, you can talk the vast majority of people into doing what you want them to do (or a reasonable facsimile thereof)...the rest, you have to do the hard way. The major training point of the scenario you're referring to is considering whether the second officer escalated too quickly and if there was the potential for a verbal resolution. Sometimes there isn't and you have to work the puzzle another way, but you have to consider all the tools in your toolbox.
          That is about the best answer you are going to find
          Since some people need to be told by notes in crayon .......Don't PM me with without prior permission. If you can't discuss the situation in the open forum ----it must not be that important

          My new word for the day is FOCUS, when someone irritates you tell them to FOCUS

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          • #6
            It's hard to say what would have been done. Due to the fact there is no 100% standard in training across the country. I've seen the video and based on my standard and training state and department wise there were a lot of flaws done.

            What any of these videos show is how you at your department wthin your state with your traing and resources, what can you do? It don't think of them as Monday Morning Quarterbacking I look at it as if I'm in their shoes doing and say nope do this or that.

            I was trying to think as to why the officer jumps out at a 10, yes I get the slow spees 1.5 miles refusing to yield. And we missed about a minute of aduio so don't know what was said. But this a a little flag for me. He didn't bring it down. And yes I've been in those shoes of jumping out at 10 and not dropping it down. The communication was poor on his end as the driver being passive resistive too.

            In the end we can slice and dice the video and find flaws but sadly in the current climate no matter what we do department leaders will get pressure for the political tards and we are at the bottom of that ladder
            I'd rather be judged by 12 rather carried by 6.

            It should be noted that any and all post that are made are based on my own thought and opinions. And are not related or implied to represent the department I work for.

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