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How best to deal with an LEO who may not be aware of uncommon laws.

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  • #16
    Originally posted by SlowDownThere
    Why do you want an automatic rifle?
    Why not?

    In all seriousness, they are very good investments, gaining hundreds to thousands of dollars a year in some cases, but mainly they're just really, really fun to shoot and a great collectors piece due to their curio status and general rarity.

    I'm just thankful I live in one of the few remaining countries that still allows it's citizens to own arms without too much hassle (although calling the process to own an automatic rifle a 'hassle' would be the understatement of the century). An armed citizenry is the only way to garauntee a free society.

    One thing I can say for you all though is if you ever meet someone who legally owns an automatic, they're probably the least dangerous person you'll ever meet. The kind of people who go through all the trouble of the process I'm talking about are NOT the kind of people you have to worry about. To put it in perspective, there have only been 3 shootings committed with legally owned automatic weapons since the regulations were passed in 1934, 2 were self defense and the shooters were cleared of all charges, and the third was a police officer (who may have had access to automatics anyway) killing his wife.

    Once again thanks for all your responses.
    Last edited by danp; 10-06-2005, 09:19 AM.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by ctt
      This is how the situation that danp is describing would begin. =)
      You hit that one on the head, I'm sure that's EXACTLY how it would begin.

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      • #18
        Maybe I'm not a good one to ask...

        Originally posted by ctt
        This is how the situation that danp is describing would begin. =)

        ...since I'm in favor of gun control. Maybe my neck is blue after all.
        You can now follow me on twitter.

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        • #19
          No Fan Of Gun Control

          I am more in favor of crime control such as two rounds center of mass and no more repeat offenders.

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          • #20
            I'm more interested in how an M16 is worth 10K. The tax stamp is only a couple hundred bucks. Just curious because I could be sitting on a small fortune.
            Jerry
            "If all else fails, stop using all else!"

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            • #21
              An M16 is only worth 10 grand if it was registered as a NFA weapon before 1986. Since only a finite number were registered and are transferable to individuals the price is very high. If you have M16s at your department they are probably not listed on ATFs logs of NFA weapons making them "dealer samples", transferable only to Police departments or class 3 dealers. A dealer sample M16 in perfect condition is worth about $400.

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              • #22
                Ditto talk to your sheriff or Chief of Police. One place I worked the Sheriff came in one day and said "do not worry if you get a report of Machine gun fire or explosions, down by spencersburg, The fellow has a license, for that, and it's Okay, He's a Postman"
                Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by jerrymaccauley
                  I'm more interested in how an M16 is worth 10K. The tax stamp is only a couple hundred bucks. Just curious because I could be sitting on a small fortune.
                  The value of a "transferrable" (civilian ownable) M16 is around $9k+ at the moment, they can go up to $24k if it's a rare colt in good condition. The reason for this is a combination of the Gun Control Act of 1968 which in part banned the importation of select-fire weapons for civilian ownership and the Firearm Owner's Protection Act of 1986 which in part banned the domestic manufacture of select-fire weapons for civilian ownership.

                  So basically if it was made before May 19th 1986 a civilian can own it, after that it's only you guys and military. The supply is frozen (last report I saw was there are about 700,000 transferrable automatic weapons legally registered in the US) but the demand is not dropping so prices are going up.

                  If you have a legally registered M16 in your own personal collection and it isn't stuck to you (sometimes it's possible to bring back weapons as a veteran but rarely are they transferrable to anyone else) you could be sitting on a little goldmine.

                  If however your department has M16's they are most likely post-86 guns are not worth anything more than their regular retail value. However it has happened in the past that police departments have been sitting on civilian legal guns that they picked up at one time or another (often this is found with thompsons which currently run you around $15-25k). If a department does have pre-86 guns that are on the right forms I believe it MAY BE (not certain) possible to get these firearms back onto the collector's market. The fact is if a department is sitting on one transferrable M16, they could possibly sell it to a civilian collector and buy 10 brand new ones without spending a cent.

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                  • #24
                    To answer your question--- I'd POLITELY explain to the off. you have the required documentation, admit it is somewhat unusual for a civilian to own a machinegun & suggest that if he thinks you're lying to get ahold of another off. that HE KNOWS is a gun enthusiast to convince him. Out here where those types of guns are legal (Thank God!) we ocassionally stumble onto someone with one so most offs. here are aware they're legal. What surprises offs. out here are when they find out silencers are also legal. Having owned a pre-auction Mac-10 with silencer I 've heard all the excuses & arguments against owning these things. It's all B.S. if you ask me. One LEO out here owns 3 M2 .50cal plus a bunch of other stuff. Out here it's still the "wild west"

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by hemicop
                      Out here it's still the "wild west"
                      I'm quite jealous, I've actually always thought Arizona seemed like it would be a nice place to live and from everything I've heard it is very gun friendly.

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                      • #26
                        I don't care if you own any type of gun as long as you're not a convicted felon and you're not pointing it at me. If you feel as if you need to own a black powder rifle or fully automatic machine gun, I personally don't care. If you're pointing that thing at me though, you know my butt is gonna be hiding behind my engine block waiting for you to reload when you empty that fully automatic weapon in 2-3 seconds lol.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by SlowDownThere
                          Why do you want an automatic rifle?
                          For hunting of course. Nothing better then bullet tenderized fawn.

                          Originally posted by danp
                          An armed citizenry is the only way to guarantee a free society.
                          Funny how so many citizens in Arab states use assault rifles, grenades, and ammo as currency, yet I don
                          Last edited by chris91604; 10-10-2005, 04:47 AM.

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                          • #28
                            [QUOTE=chris91604]Funny how so many citizens in Arab states use assault rifles, grenades, and ammo as currency, yet I don

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                            • #29
                              danp,
                              Given that you live in the only gun unfriendly city in the state. I'd have all of your lawyer friend's numbers on speed dial in your cell phone. The philly pd has been known to arrest other municipal police officers for carrying in the city and have confiscated state issued side arms from state troopers who are not assigned to the belmont barracks. Granted that this was years ago, but I still feel safer carrying in other states than in philly.
                              When Society makes war on its police, it better be prepared to make friends of its criminals.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by PABear31
                                danp,
                                Given that you live in the only gun unfriendly city in the state. I'd have all of your lawyer friend's numbers on speed dial in your cell phone. The philly pd has been known to arrest other municipal police officers for carrying in the city and have confiscated state issued side arms from state troopers who are not assigned to the belmont barracks. Granted that this was years ago, but I still feel safer carrying in other states than in philly.
                                I do have my lawyer on speed dial, however my few interactions with Philadelphia PD in relation to my gun ownership have actually all been quite nice. Once I tripped in a diner and as I caught my balance my gun must have shown so an officer asked me why I was carrying a gun. I said I had a permit and that you never know what might happen which seemed to satisfy him. One other time an officer must have noticed me printing and asked to see my license but was very polite and just said thanks and handed it back.

                                My best encounter however was getting off the subway on the way back from my shooting range with a rifle case that had a Bushmaster AR-15 in it. A Septa SWAT officer was standing at the top of the steps with his partner and as I walked by said "Hey you, what's in the case". I calmly let him know that I was carrying a rifle while thinking in my head that this situation was going to go downhill fast. After a long pause he responded by saying "Awesome, I have a few of those too, aren't you glad the assault weapons ban ended?" and we ended up talking for a few minutes while his partner stood nervously quiet.

                                Hopefully my luck won't run out, the way I see it 99% of cops are great guys who aren't looking for a confrontation any more than I am so I'm not too worried.

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