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Citizens Arrest and Deputizing

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  • SlowDownThere
    replied
    Not quite that simple

    Originally posted by KY PO
    That is an interesting point. So, if a private person arrested someone for a felony offense, and the offender went to trial, was found not guilty because all they had was the private person as a witness.....then at that point, is the private person guilty of kidnapping?

    I suppose the fact that one is acquitted does not mean that one "in fact" didn't commit the crime, only that it wasn't proved. I taught at the academy, and used a different example. Say you get a call about a guy who is taking a ball bat to a car parked on the street. He's whaling the car as you show up. Curious, you ask what's up? He explains that it's his ex-wifes car, and he's ****ed cuz she just took him to the cleaners over child support.

    Since he's doing this in your presence, you arrest him (with or without a fight). Later you find out it's not his ex-wifes car, it's his own car. He can't be charged with damaging his own car. While the officer had reasonable cause (probably cause in most states) to believe an offense was being committed, and offense was not in fact committed. (Don't split hairs with me here over disorderly conduct or something, you get the idea). The police officer still made a legal arrest. He had PC.

    A private citizen who made such an arrest made an illegal one, and subjected himself to all kinds of legal ramifictaions, probably civil unless force was used and he caused an injury. Under those circumstances, maybe criminal charges would apply.

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  • KY PO
    replied
    Originally posted by onyx1976
    Just to back up everyone else, Wannabe, it's definitely a bad idea to take the law in your own hands even if you have witnessed the crime. However, the question goes to the police officers: What if you "the private citizen" and were trained in aprehention (loss prevention) or what have you, and you witnessed a man beating a woman or someone drunk out of their mind about to drive off?
    This is a very good reason for a private person not to make an arrest. A man beating a woman, unless there is some serious injury, in KY would probably be Assault 4th, a class A misdemeanor, and therefore not fall under the private persons arrest due to it not being a felony offense.

    Leave a comment:


  • KY PO
    replied
    Originally posted by SlowDownThere
    "in fact committed"
    That is an interesting point. So, if a private person arrested someone for a felony offense, and the offender went to trial, was found not guilty because all they had was the private person as a witness.....then at that point, is the private person guilty of kidnapping?

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Citizen's Arrest.

    Just to back up everyone else, Wannabe, it's definitely a bad idea to take the law in your own hands even if you have witnessed the crime. However, the question goes to the police officers: What if you "the private citizen" and were trained in aprehention (loss prevention) or what have you, and you witnessed a man beating a woman or someone drunk out of their mind about to drive off?

    Or in my case, while on patrol as a security officer, stopped at red light behind a car who did not move as light turned green, I hunked the horn but got no response. I noticed someone slummped over on the drivers seat, I put on my lightbar flashers to see if person reacted but still no response.
    I aproached car in safe manner ofcourse, and smelled very strong alcohol, I tapped on the window and still got no response from the female who was in drivers seat; I then yelled Mam!!! and she finally opened her eyes, stunned, and afraid to see a uniform I told her "relax i'm not a cop" "you fell asleep at the wheel, I can smell alcohol mam! I think you should pull into a parking lot to rest a little while". she said "ok thanks" and drove off.
    I went on my way but aprox 5 minutes later I decided to drive in the direction she drove to see if she had pulled in somewhere because I felt uneasy about letting this person drive off and if I had called the cops at this point they would have asked, why I didn't you call sooner (my mistake, I know, I learned don't worry, it was an 3rd shift anyway and wasn't really thinking due to nothing going on all night, but that's no excuse).
    Anyway what do you think I should have done? please answer the first question an according to your state laws, I will get the I dea. I know what I would do now ofcourse but I want police input. Thanks, sorry to drag this so long.

    Leave a comment:


  • SlowDownThere
    replied
    Not Quite

    Originally posted by SWH
    IIRC, in NY a citizen is able to 'arrest' a person that commits a felony in the citizen's presence. Not sure on the handcuffs.

    And in NY, disobeying an order from a PO to help him in the apprehension of a criminal is a misdemeanor.
    Close, but not quite.

    In NYS, a person is able to arrest a person for a felony when it has, in fact, been committed. Also able to arrest another for any other offense, in fact committed in his presence. The phrase "in fact committed" should be troubling to any citizen thinking about making an arrest. A police officer needs "reasonable cause to believe" the offense was committed. For a private citizen, the offense must have "in fact been committed." A much different, and heavier burden. I always advise people not to do it.

    Leave a comment:


  • SCConstable2004
    replied
    In SC a citizen also has the right to resist an UNLAWFUL arrest with the force required to stop the arrest, if the person has a reasonable belief he is being unlawfully detained. While this generally does not apply to LEO's, if he whips your @$$ to avoid what he perceives as an unlawfull "citizen's arrest" he likely has legal grounds for a law suit. Be a good witness. Even when off-duty, I try to do the same.
    Last edited by SCConstable2004; 10-05-2005, 09:10 AM.

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  • Bodie
    replied
    With this kids medical issue & off the wall ideas we have a problem brewing.
    Last edited by Bodie; 10-06-2005, 06:58 AM.

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  • PhilipCal
    replied
    Citizen's arrest and deputizing

    You just got a million bucks worth of good advice. Heed it.

    Leave a comment:


  • WTPD3534
    replied
    Put the handcuffs down and back away. Carrying handcuffs around with you when you are not a cop is one surefire way to A. get yourself in trouble or B. at the minimum get looked at like a weirdo.

    The chances of you being able to catch and cuff someone who just commited a felony with nothing but a pair of handcuffs, your charming personality, and no training are slim and none. The chances of you getting hurt, or questioned by the police about why you have handcuffs on the other hand, are very high.

    Do yourself a favor and don't think about cuffing until if/when you get hired.

    Leave a comment:


  • ctt
    replied
    Also, if you choose to carry handcuffs and there is an issue as to whether the detainment was justified, a prosecutor may use that as evidence against you that indicates that you were out looking for a confrontation and that your actions may have been more of a result of your desire to detain someone than to detain a person that has committed a crime that warranted a citizen's arrest.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bodie
    replied
    People get shot, stabbed or the crap beat out of them trying a foolish stunt like a citizens arrest and if thet does npt happen and you are wrong you get sued. Nothing worse then loosing your life to a dirtbag unless you loose lots of money.

    If you restrain an innocent person with handcuffs you can be charged with kidnapping a FELON you would then be for life.

    Leave a comment:


  • irishlad2nv
    replied
    Originally posted by WannabeinLE
    Just wanted to get clarification on a citizen arrest and what my rights are as a citizen if I see a robbery in progress or if someone commits against myself. It seems like you dont see this anymore, not sure if its because people are afraid of the law. And have any of you encountered/dealt with a citizens arrest or had to deputize a citizen to aid in an arrest?

    Also, I have a pair of cuffs (and a sick cuff key at that), say if I were to use these cuffs to put someone under a citizens arrest...is that illegal or would that upset that arresting officer?
    Don't go out looking for a crime to take place in your presence now! And even wih the handcuffs, if you are not properly trained on how to use them on someone (yes its more difficult then just slapping them on someone), you can be sued big time if you hurt that person somehow...I would highly advise you to sit back and be a good witness and call 911 or let LE handle the situation.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tennsix
    replied
    Don't be a hero unless you have to be one. Cops have radios and backup and bullett resistent vests and pepper spray and asp's and cuffs and tasers and duty weapons......and you have a pair of cuffs, a moral sensibility, and hopefully a stong desire to go home alive.
    And none of that stuff is any good without proper training. A set off cuffs are useless if they are crammed up a place where the sun doesn't shine.

    Leave a comment:


  • KY PO
    replied
    Originally posted by WannabeinLE
    Just wanted to get clarification on a citizen arrest and what my rights are as a citizen if I see a robbery in progress or if someone commits against myself. It seems like you dont see this anymore, not sure if its because people are afraid of the law. And have any of you encountered/dealt with a citizens arrest or had to deputize a citizen to aid in an arrest?

    Also, I have a pair of cuffs (and a sick cuff key at that), say if I were to use these cuffs to put someone under a citizens arrest...is that illegal or would that upset that arresting officer?
    In some states you can make a citizens arrest if you witness a felony. First, you have to know the difference between felony's and misdemeanors, and depending on the charge these can be minute details. Second, I'd worry less about the handcuffs (Or gun if you have one) and worry more about getting your butt out of there and calling the cops.

    Don't be a hero unless you have to be one. Cops have radios and backup and bullett resistent vests and pepper spray and asp's and cuffs and tasers and duty weapons......and you have a pair of cuffs, a moral sensibility, and hopefully a stong desire to go home alive.

    Leave a comment:


  • gotthblues
    replied
    i wouldnt recommend a citz arrest, its a good way to get your *** kicked and with the "you can sue anyone" mentallity, it just isnt worth it. be a good witness and make a phone call.

    Leave a comment:

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