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the one bad day

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  • blueronin
    replied
    Auxofc74 i got your message, don't know if you got mine back. I'm new to the forum and havn't figured it all out-yet. I'm also pretty dumb with a computer. starting computer class this week. If my message didn't get through let me know, i'll post the answer here

    Leave a comment:


  • RabbitMPD
    replied
    AUXOFC74,

    I don't mean for this to come off sounding like a personal attack but you seem to have the attitude that the world is out to get you. Everything is somebody else

    Leave a comment:


  • blueronin
    replied
    Bad day

    Auxof74. I went to the acadamy in Cleveland. Which one did you attend?

    Leave a comment:


  • pateshane
    replied
    You should apply with departments in Florida you will have better luck.

    Leave a comment:


  • mach4
    replied
    I was lucky when I was in the reserve academy many years ago with my firearms instructor. He taught us to watch coat pockets and purses. To drive his point home and improve our safety he had us go to the thrift shops and buy old coats and if you were female old purses. He had us go to the range and practice firing from the pockets and purses. His reasoning was that we would learn to watch their hands and if we were off duty be able to use that experince to protect ourselfs. I never forgot that training when I became a full time officer or now. I still practice shooting from a purse. A good instructor will tell you it's better to be tried by 12 than buried by 6. From what you discribed you did the right thing.

    Leave a comment:


  • AUXOFC74
    replied
    So all this said and done we ultimatley passed felony traffic stops ... 3 of us are getting our law enforcement careers blackballed by this guy. What are we to do ? And for the record its kinda hard to miss a large 357 magnum redgun jammed into the wasteband of an idiot behind the wheel of a patrol car, theres a reason ASP makes the simulation guns out of a hard red resin plastic material.
    Last edited by AUXOFC74; 09-28-2005, 10:36 PM.

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  • cst.sb
    replied
    Originally posted by scooterlee
    Im sorry that your having bad luck up in Cleveland. If you were down in Cincinnati, I'd try to help you out. I teach in several OPOTA academies down here and I can tell you that we don't use "recruits" as role players. The reason is simple, They haven't "been there done that." When you have recruits act as bad guys, they tend to become immature and do stupid stuff!!!
    Been there done that. Our first senario (a stolen bike) went south bigtime because my one of my troopmates in the bad guy role went way overboard and assaulted my partner. I handcuffed him and he still continued to act up. I had to whisper in his ear to calm down I was going to dump him on the ground before he calmed down.

    As the roleplay was spinning out of control so was the training Cpl. And she lost it on my partner and I. Her reasoning was that we hadn't been trained to handcuff, or taught what the assault sections were. She accused my partner and I of being too aggressive. The to cover her own *** because she had become unglued and was the one that should have been controlling the situation. She told the entire troop that "WE" had screwed up by making a false arrest and would have been charged ourselves, or sued civilly.

    It was total twightlight zone.

    She was a wingnut at the best of times and I am old enough to know what battles I can win, so I sucked it up. We were under the magnifying glass for little while until she transfered out. That was a good day.

    I totally agree. If you use the recruits as actors, especially in testing senarios, there is a chance that they will deviate from the game plan and F*** things up.

    Leave a comment:


  • irishpump
    replied
    Originally posted by 6233108
    Which in the above scenario would be the proper response. If you think a gun has to be pointed at an officer for deadly force to be justified you are sorely mistaken. For someone to draw and fire from the waistband takes 1.5-2 seconds if they are "average" and around 1 second if they are proficient. To fire from low ready or point usually takes anywhere from .40 -.75 of a second.
    He WAS RIGHT TO SHOOT. The felon had the means and opportunity to deliver deadly force to the officer in a matter of 2 seconds maximum.
    The reason I said it was because I didn't see any mention of someone reaching for their weapon. Either I missed it, or he was posting it for the first time in his second post. Regardless, I still said "pointed at you." I should clarify that if a suspect had reached for his/her gun, I would have reacted the same way. Anyway, when I read it the first time it sounded like he shot someone for having a gun on him. In all honesty, it just didn't come out right when I typed it.
    Last edited by irishpump; 09-28-2005, 08:14 PM.

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  • YJ95
    replied
    Hope I don't get in trouble for posting here. I'm not LEO, but am a student of CJ. Only reason I'm posting is due to the last post. My instructor just said something about this last class. He stated that most people, if they have a gun pointed at a suspect, and the suspect reached down into his pocket, that he could remove a gun and get a shot off before you would realize it and shoot your gun. He said the reaction times are just a little behind, and you must make up for that. Just thought I would throw that in.

    Leave a comment:


  • 6233108
    replied
    Originally posted by irishpump
    Maybe I missed something, but:

    "I noticed a gun tucked in his wasteband, so i shot him with the simulated gun thru the drivers side window. (he was in a police car, with a shotgun , and has a gun in his wasteband)"

    The suspect didn't have the gun pointed at you and you shot him?
    Which in the above scenario would be the proper response. If you think a gun has to be pointed at an officer for deadly force to be justified you are sorely mistaken. For someone to draw and fire from the waistband takes 1.5-2 seconds if they are "average" and around 1 second if they are proficient. To fire from low ready or point usually takes anywhere from .40 -.75 of a second.
    He WAS RIGHT TO SHOOT. The felon had the means and opportunity to deliver deadly force to the officer in a matter of 2 seconds maximum.

    Leave a comment:


  • AUXOFC74
    replied
    Funny how everyone else made a similar mistake I was just the first. one did it with a shotgun..That was not a bad day, it was early in the acad. I passed firearms with an "A" no further incidents..

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  • scooterlee
    replied
    Best of Luck to ya!

    Enjoy the sun

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  • gotthblues
    replied
    we had instructors role play at ours, and they set it up, so that 4 out of 5 scenes, you die, just to make a point, but they didnt act like idiots, just made a point. it was an eye opener. everybody died several times,

    Leave a comment:


  • AUXOFC74
    replied
    Well if such were the case.. i scored over 90 % on every single test , quiz, and the like, had perfect attendance . Apparantly they are not telling them that. My crime scene investigation scored 94% , and my traffic crash investigations , and ADAP were flawless, no re attempts. Cleveland sucks .. we are outta here.

    Leave a comment:


  • scooterlee
    replied
    Im sorry that your having bad luck up in Cleveland. If you were down in Cincinnati, I'd try to help you out. I teach in several OPOTA academies down here and I can tell you that we don't use "recruits" as role players. The reason is simple, They haven't "been there done that." When you have recruits act as bad guys, they tend to become immature and do stupid stuff! As far as your scenerio goes, I sorta breezed thru it, but I think I caught the jist of it! I wouldn't worry to much about screwing up on a traffic stop scenerio in the academy. We see all types of stuff while teaching in the academy, thats why we have an academy w/ role playing scenerios. I'd rather you make the mistake in the academy and learn from it, rather than go out on the street and make a mistake. The whole reason that you do the scenerios is so you learn from it, and your instructor should realize that!

    I can tell you that the majority of your "evaluation" from the academy is going to come from the tests and what type of a role model you are while atttending the academy. Ive had to give several references to background investigators, and out of all the remarks Ive given, Ive never judged the person by how well they did on a traffic stop scenerio. Its the overall impression that I refer too.

    Don't think that this is isolated to just Ohio. There are alot of states that have zero training in the academy and its just as "boot-legged." My advice, find a department that has there own full-time academy staff, i.e: columbus, cincinnati, dayton, State patrol. That way you'll get what your looking for, because that's all they do!!

    Good luck, let me know if you need anymore help!!

    Leave a comment:

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