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  • Spikerz
    replied
    Originally posted by PhilipCal View Post
    "Starting process to become a Reserve Officer". A large part of any successful application process is the ability to read and follow simple instructions. This is "Ask a Cop". Currently, you are NOT one. You can ask a question, and you can respond to replies to your original post. That's what you can do. What you can't do is respond as if you were already an Officer. Pretty simple, isn't it?
    Indeed my mistake all. I actually thought I was still browsing in the General section and not the Ask section.
    I apologize to all, and hope it didn't detract from the OP's excellent question.

    Mike

    Leave a comment:


  • PhilipCal
    replied
    Originally posted by Spikerz View Post
    In California - As told to me by family members who were detectives with local PD's and SO's.

    The best bet. Stay in the bedroom, make sure you have 911 on speaker phone. Speak in a loud, clear manner that you are warning the person to stay away, and that they're coming through the door. 911 calls are recorded.
    If they come through that door, and you are in fear of your life. You can use deadly force.

    To avoid the horrific civil suits in California, make sure you don't shoot someone in the back. That can be seen as they're running away, and no longer a threat.

    As others have said, and is the case, it is completely state dependent.
    "Starting process to become a Reserve Officer". A large part of any successful application process is the ability to read and follow simple instructions. This is "Ask a Cop". Currently, you are NOT one. You can ask a question, and you can respond to replies to your original post. That's what you can do. What you can't do is respond as if you were already an Officer. Pretty simple, isn't it?

    Leave a comment:


  • Coogan
    replied
    Originally posted by RoadKingTrooper View Post
    Forum: Ask a Cop

    Looking for advice? Is there something you always wanted to ask a cop? Only LEOs should answer questions.

    Yet another non LEO giving "advice" in Ask a Cop


    I think he was referencing someone...


    In California - As told to me by family members who were detectives with local PD's and SO's.

    The best bet. Stay in the bedroom, make sure you have 911 on speaker phone. Speak in a loud, clear manner that you are warning the person to stay away, and that they're coming through the door. 911 calls are recorded.
    If they come through that door, and you are in fear of your life. You can use deadly force.

    To avoid the horrific civil suits in California, make sure you don't shoot someone in the back. That can be seen as they're running away, and no longer a threat.

    As others have said, and is the case, it is completely state dependent.

    Leave a comment:


  • The State
    replied
    Means, Proximity and intent. If you can provide these three elements then deadly force is justified in MN. Behind a closed door might be a stretch but with that being said if this was my house I would be placing holes through my new oak door.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dingo990
    replied
    Many states now seem to grant homeowners immunity from lawsuits if they use force in defending their homes.

    I would not be comfortable shooting through a door. Like other people have pointed out, you don't know who is there. Family member, drunk college kid or the police department because they saw you had an open door or a neighbor called them about the guy who broke into your house (I know cops who think not announcing their presence in a house is more "tactical").

    I say error on saving your own life, but I doubt I would find myself squeezing rounds through a closed door when the only information I had was "someone is in the house"

    Leave a comment:


  • BayouCop
    replied
    Not in Louisiana. Check the Ohio criminal statutes regarding justification of homicide. Louisiana is very specific that citizens are within their rights to use deadly force to prevent someone from attempting to forcibly gain entry to their home, or any other occupied home, or to use deadly force against someone who has already gained entry. This means that a Louisiana person may shoot a burglar who is in the home, or outside trying to get in, but not one who is fleeing *and is outside*. We reserve the right to shoot the scum in the back if he doesn't make it to the door in time.
    Last edited by BayouCop; 12-03-2010, 04:33 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • LA DEP
    replied
    In CA, esp. in any of the more liberal areas of the state, you could very well get hemmed up for shooting through the door at a completely unidentified threat as there are more than a few DAs that are not going to buy your statement of "I was in fear for my life ect" when you have absolutely no idea who or what is on the other side of that door.

    Leave a comment:


  • kam81
    replied
    Originally posted by Michigan View Post
    Stating the obvious isn't normallly needed when speaking to other cops.

    We were all addressing the situation that the OP had described. I don't think anyone here or anywhere else would start shooting thru a door when they know they have their 4 year old boys sleeping in the next room. I take my last sentence back, of course we know there are morons that would shoot regardless of knowing where the rest of their family is; however, telling a bunch of cops that is redundant.
    I offered a what if to the OPs scenario...which is what I thought discussing these things on a forum was intended for....I don't feel that I was stating the obvious, nor is this site strictly used by other cops. I'm not sure what your beef is, if any.

    Leave a comment:


  • Brad2323
    replied
    RoadKing Trooper is right. Someone with the authority should get Spikerz banned.

    Leave a comment:


  • PhilipCal
    replied
    Originally posted by kam81 View Post
    what you arent getting is that we have no argument or disagreement, as my only issue with shooting through a door concerned other (legal) occupants in the residence! my situation is the same as yours...only people in my home are my wife and i...I would be putting rounds through the door without hesitation...it would be different if i had other family members staying in the house...
    Ya could fooled me,but I'll go along with you on this one. Just that not everyone's situation is as simple as ours.

    Leave a comment:


  • Michigan
    replied
    Originally posted by kam81 View Post
    what you arent getting is that we have no argument or disagreement, as my only issue with shooting through a door concerned other (legal) occupants in the residence! my situation is the same as yours...only people in my home are my wife and i...I would be putting rounds through the door without hesitation...it would be different if i had other family members staying in the house...
    Stating the obvious isn't normallly needed when speaking to other cops.

    We were all addressing the situation that the OP had described. I don't think anyone here or anywhere else would start shooting thru a door when they know they have their 4 year old boys sleeping in the next room. I take my last sentence back, of course we know there are morons that would shoot regardless of knowing where the rest of their family is; however, telling a bunch of cops that is redundant.

    Leave a comment:


  • RoadKingTrooper
    replied
    Originally posted by Spikerz View Post
    In California - As told to me by family members who were detectives with local PD's and SO's.

    The best bet. Stay in the bedroom, make sure you have 911 on speaker phone. Speak in a loud, clear manner that you are warning the person to stay away, and that they're coming through the door. 911 calls are recorded.
    If they come through that door, and you are in fear of your life. You can use deadly force.

    To avoid the horrific civil suits in California, make sure you don't shoot someone in the back. That can be seen as they're running away, and no longer a threat.

    As others have said, and is the case, it is completely state dependent.
    Forum: Ask a Cop

    Looking for advice? Is there something you always wanted to ask a cop? Only LEOs should answer questions.

    Yet another non LEO giving "advice" in Ask a Cop

    Leave a comment:


  • kam81
    replied
    Originally posted by PhilipCal View Post
    OK Kam, I don't propose to argue with you all night on this point. You have your views, I have mine. I do feel that the forum has reasonably addressed the situation previously described, and I'll concede that there probably isn't a perfect solution. You mention a "position of advantage" in your replies, but aren't specific as to what that position would be. I can only address the overall situation which was advanced by the OP. Again, I commend you to the replies of our colleagues. I don't especially like shooting through a closed door either, and I can see your point to a degree. In my personal situation, it wouldn't be a problem as my Wife and I are the only two people in the house, and I can readily discern her presence in the bedroom with me. See what I mean?
    what you arent getting is that we have no argument or disagreement, as my only issue with shooting through a door concerned other (legal) occupants in the residence! my situation is the same as yours...only people in my home are my wife and i...I would be putting rounds through the door without hesitation...it would be different if i had other family members staying in the house...

    Leave a comment:


  • PhilipCal
    replied
    OK Kam, I don't propose to argue with you all night on this point. You have your views, I have mine. I do feel that the forum has reasonably addressed the situation previously described, and I'll concede that there probably isn't a perfect solution. You mention a "position of advantage" in your replies, but aren't specific as to what that position would be. I can only address the overall situation which was advanced by the OP. Again, I commend you to the replies of our colleagues. I don't especially like shooting through a closed door either, and I can see your point to a degree. In my personal situation, it wouldn't be a problem as my Wife and I are the only two people in the house, and I can readily discern her presence in the bedroom with me. See what I mean?

    Leave a comment:


  • kam81
    replied
    Originally posted by Michigan View Post
    Oh, so you're saying if I hear my wife on the other side of the door not to shoot through it? I see. Sorry.

    Hence the -DuH-
    you arent understanding my point....which is if there are other people in the residence that are unaccounted for, you are taking a huge risk by shooting through the door (as opposed to what i said before, which was take a position of advantage and see what you're shooting at, as well as your backdrop)

    Originally posted by PhilipCal View Post
    I believe you're looking at a perfect world scenario, and one which seldom exists. I wouldn't describe shooting through the door under these circumstances as "indiscriminate".My colleagues have addressed the situation in a very cogent and realistic manner. Take another look at the original situation and the forum's replies to them. They represent real life answers to a real life situation.
    how in the world is what i described only feasible in a "perfect world scenario"??? its a crap sandwich either way....i'm only suggesting an alternative to shooting through a closed door...i guess training is different everywhere you go, and my views reflect that.
    Last edited by kam81; 12-03-2010, 12:54 PM.

    Leave a comment:

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