"Court to Cops: Stop Tasing People into Compliance"

[normlwe]

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010...or/#more-21187

In regards to this article, some commenters mentioned that OC spray might be a better alternative. Including any comments you may have about the article, I am really interested in what would happen if an officer had sprayed someone with pepper spray instead of having using the taser during one of the oft-cited taser misuse cases. Is it permissible to use pepper spray if you are not going to be detaining them? If so, then do you have to call EMS to stay with them until their eyes recover? How soon after being sprayed would they be able to drive? Or if they are definitely going to be detained, do they have to go to a hospital first, or just get their eyes washed out at the scene?

Sorry, I know asked many different questions, I am just curious about the potential for use of less-than-lethal weapons and their impact.

thanks

[Smurfette_76]

If your focus is truly OC spray (not pepper spray) and its effects, then why post the article?

[t150vsuptpr]

Is it permissible to use pepper spray if you are not going to be detaining them?

If at the moment you taze or spray you aren't going to detain them, then you have no reason to be tazing or spraying.

Whether tazing or spraying, you best have a good reason for doing it. Same criteria here. Either they have committed an assault, resisted arrest, or etc ... or they have somehow made you believe they are about to do so (raised a fist back as if to swing, etc) ... through their actions.

If anyone is tazing or spraying just to get a signature or because of some unreasonable fear or "just because they can", it likely will be a very short career they end on the wrong end of a suit ... or maybe even behind bars.

[normlwe]

If your focus is truly OC spray (not pepper spray) and its effects, then why post the article?

I posted the article because it highlights the challenges of using one form of less-than-lethal weapon. I shifted my question to OC spray because if officer's are indeed more restricted from using TASER's (in jurisdictions lying inside the 9th circuit in this case), then many will still have OC Spray at their disposal as another type of less-than-lethal weapon.

Also, I was under the impression that the terms Pepper Spray and OC spray were interchangable as O.C. is the active "hot" ingredient in the Hot Pepper.

[RoadKingTrooper]

If your focus is truly OC spray (not pepper spray) and its effects, then why post the article?

LOL reminds me when we started carrying PR 24's. Had one young troop who described using it for a strike on a subject, no arrest or report. As an Instructor I asked his rationale and failure to document. His reply?........It was a warning strike
LOL

[BCSD Frank]

Jesus... I've been tazered and I've been sprayed with Freeze+P. Given the choice, I'd rather ride the lightning. Five seconds, and it's over. Freeze+P is the "gift that keeps on giving," for the rest of the day. I hate that stuff!!

[mikeymedic]

I hate using OC due to how long afterwards I have to spend with the subject crying. I feel bad for the 9th circus...i mean circuit.

[L-1]

Let's Not Kneejerk Too Much

You can find an analysis of the court's decision and how it actually impacts law enforcement at http://www.jones-mayer.com/clientale...2428122909.htm

Read it first and then decide for yourself how much of a restriction it really imposes.

All it says is that the Taser cannot be used unless the officer is able to justify that the use is based upon an objectively reasonable belief that a subject poses an immediate threat to the officer or others.

The Court ruled that “a simple statement by an officer that he fears for his safety or the safety of others is not enough; there must be objective factors to justify such a concern.” Such weapons cannot be used simply because a person is disobeying orders, or acting erratically, unless it can be proven that such behavior created the immediate threat of danger to the officer or others.

If an immediate threat of danger exists, spend an extra minute to articulate that in your report and you are in compliance. Not a big deal.

[Sarge048]

If I had my choices of getting sprayed w/OC, whacked with a baton, or taking the Taze my answer is:

"Just taze me bro!!!!"

[crass cop]

"Crass Cop to d-bag Criminals: STOP BREAKING THE LAW AND/OR NOT COMPLYING AND YOU WILL NEVER HAVE THIS PROBLEM"

and as Sarge and BCSD advised....just TASER me...5 seconds and Im recovered.

[DAL]

I would not rely on wired.com for a legal analysis.

[bigcop97]

If I had my choices of getting sprayed w/OC, whacked with a baton, or taking the Taze my answer is:

"Just taze me bro!!!!"

I agree completely, I would rather take 5 full rides than get sprayed with the liquid hell OC again... the Taser just sounds so invasive to the public it is easy to HATE on it

[nuthead]

The problem isn't the use of the TAZER or OC spray; the problem is report writing and officers not articulating why they used either.

[CruiserClass]

"I'm not supposed to tase you, so I guess I'll use my baton for something besides scratching under my vest, picking my lunch box up out of the passenger floor board and pushing my passenger mirror back out after going through the car wash."

After a few thumpity-thump-thumps I bet the Taser's looking better and better.

[LA DEP]

If I had my choices of getting sprayed w/OC, whacked with a baton, or taking the Taze my answer is:

"Just taze me bro!!!!"

Add me to this list.....

Of course, the last handful of times I have been forced to suck Freeze +P fumes, hit with a baton, and/or kicked,punched,folded,spindled ect have been at the hands of fellow deputies (or trainees)......which means either they have lousy aim, or they really don't like me......