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Sirens for funeral escort?

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  • TJx2
    replied
    Originally posted by John M. View Post
    This is bordering on the rather silly don't you think?

    -John
    yes, I do think so...but not for the same reasons you believe it to be silly. Here funerals are marked by purple flags and a purple rotating tear drop light on the lead car. Processions may proceed through controlled intersections whether the light is red or green, if it is possible to do so safely. No police escort necessary.

    Leave a comment:


  • John M.
    replied
    Originally posted by Nobody View Post
    no, your arguments that because the law (apparently) says you may have lights/sirens, you must activate your lights/sirens is silly

    I have a gun. The law says I may use that gun to preserve life or prevent serious injury. The law does not say I must use that gun to preserve life or prevent serious injury.
    I understand what you are saying here, however my job would be impossible to do with such equipment;

    28-624
    B. If the driver of an authorized emergency vehicle is operating at least one lighted lamp displaying a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle, the driver may:

    1. Notwithstanding this chapter, park or stand.

    2. Proceed past a red or stop signal or stop sign, but only after slowing down as necessary for safe operation.

    3. Exceed the prima facie speed limits if the driver does not endanger life or property.

    4. Disregard laws or rules governing the direction of movement or turning in specified directions.

    C. The exemptions authorized by this section for an authorized emergency vehicle apply only if the driver of the vehicle while in motion sounds an audible signal by bell, siren or exhaust whistle as reasonably necessary and if the vehicle is equipped with at least one lighted lamp displaying a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle,

    In order to pass the procession, enter a controlled intersection or to clear traffic from our path or the path of the procession requires us to utilize lights/siren.
    The only way that the law allows us to perform the movements and actions that we must do is when we are operating with said lights and siren.


    -John

    Leave a comment:


  • 11b101abn
    replied
    Here LE escorts for funerals are the norm, not the exception. It is considered a part of daily duties.

    Having escorted many funerals, I would travel ahead of the procession and block intersections to allow the expedient travel of the procession. To do this, airhorn and occasonally 'whooping" the siren is what I would use.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nobody
    replied
    I like pie.............
    Last edited by Nobody; 10-08-2009, 09:22 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • DACP
    replied
    Where I use to live, and where I live know, funeral escorts are something that for like $50.00 will get you a police escort. if you do not pay the money then the procession fallows all laws and stops at all lights, and proceeds when green, there is no special exemption as far as I know that lets them go through a red light, the “escort” vehicles have purple and amber strobes on them, but that to me was so I knew if I was stopped at the light and cut off, I knew from a distance what direction they were going, not that It ever mattered as I knew where I was going.

    Leave a comment:


  • John M.
    replied
    Originally posted by TJx2 View Post
    They are to be visible 500 feet, heard...etc. when being operated. Nothing in any statute you have posted says that you shall operate any emergency equipment...only that you shall be equipped with it,
    This is bordering on the rather silly don't you think?

    -John

    Leave a comment:


  • John M.
    replied
    Originally posted by Sleuth View Post
    John M, you are claiming that all police cars, fire trucks, and ambulances are NOT police cars, fire trucks, or ambulances if they do not have their sirens on.



    You need to rethink your argument

    What?
    Where are you getting that from?

    John

    Leave a comment:


  • Sleuth
    replied
    John M, you are claiming that all police cars, fire trucks, and ambulances are NOT police cars, fire trucks, or ambulances if they do not have their sirens on.



    You need to rethink your argument

    Leave a comment:


  • TJx2
    replied
    Originally posted by John M. View Post
    "A funeral escort vehicle or military escort vehicle shall be equipped with at least one lighted lamp exhibiting a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and an audible signal by bell, siren or exhaust whistle as required under section 28-624."

    Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you here, however I fail to understand if the lights are to be visible from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and the siren is to be audible, how this is possible if they are not operating.


    John
    They are to be visible 500 feet, heard...etc. when being operated. Nothing in any statute you have posted says that you shall operate any emergency equipment...only that you shall be equipped with it,

    Leave a comment:


  • TexasAggieOfc
    replied
    We do the escorts for the Funerals around here, and we do NOT use the sirens. Very disrespectful to drive through town at 20 mph with Hyperyelp!

    We do "bust" intersections, but when we do a funeral, we have a lead officer (either PD or SO, depending on the cemetary location from the church or funeral home) leading the procession. All other officers, including the Sheriff and Chief Deputy block the major intersections until the procession has cleared.

    Funerals are not considered an "emergency" here. If I get a call that requires an immediate response, we disregard the funeral escort. They are a courtesy and to a certain extent, expected from a small Southern community like mine.

    Leave a comment:


  • John M.
    replied
    Originally posted by TJx2 View Post
    There is difference between shall be equipped... and shall operate...
    "A funeral escort vehicle or military escort vehicle shall be equipped with at least one lighted lamp exhibiting a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and an audible signal by bell, siren or exhaust whistle as required under section 28-624."

    Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you here, however I fail to understand if the lights are to be visible from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and the siren is to be audible, how this is possible if they are not operating.


    John

    Leave a comment:


  • TJx2
    replied
    Originally posted by John M. View Post
    "A funeral escort vehicle or military escort vehicle shall be equipped with at least one lighted lamp exhibiting a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and an audible signal by bell, siren or exhaust whistle as required under section 28-624."




    And this is why we are there. There is a difference between simply driving at a slow speed and following the vehicle in front of you and attempting to devote your entire attention to the plethora of situations one encounters while operating a motor vehicle in a normal environment. Most especially while dealing with the grief and distress of having just lost a loved one.




    And this has been done before, however it is not always practical or for those with limited incomes always possible.

    John
    There is difference between shall be equipped... and shall operate...

    Leave a comment:


  • John M.
    replied
    Originally posted by Sleuth View Post
    John M, you seem to assume a few things:
    1. The Arizona Revised Statues do not require you to use lights and siren, they allow you to. Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it.
    "A funeral escort vehicle or military escort vehicle shall be equipped with at least one lighted lamp exhibiting a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and an audible signal by bell, siren or exhaust whistle as required under section 28-624."


    Originally posted by Sleuth View Post
    2. If, in their time of extreme grief, people are not likely to make safe and sound judgments about operating a motor vehicle, they are by definition operating impaired and should not be driving at all.
    And this is why we are there. There is a difference between simply driving at a slow speed and following the vehicle in front of you and attempting to devote your entire attention to the plethora of situations one encounters while operating a motor vehicle in a normal environment. Most especially while dealing with the grief and distress of having just lost a loved one.


    Originally posted by Sleuth View Post
    So, why not get them a bus - shorter motorcade, a driver who is not consumed with grief, safer streets, and no need for lights and sirens.
    And this has been done before, however it is not always practical or for those with limited incomes always possible.

    John

    Leave a comment:


  • Sleuth
    replied
    John M, you seem to assume a few things:
    1. The Arizona Revised Statues do not require you to use lights and siren, they allow you to. Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it.
    2. If, in their time of extreme grief, people are not likely to make safe and sound judgments about operating a motor vehicle, they are by definition operating impaired and should not be driving at all.

    So, why not get them a bus - shorter motorcade, a driver who is not consumed with grief, safer streets, and no need for lights and sirens.

    Leave a comment:


  • John M.
    replied
    This and other related topics comes up from time to time, and I am more than happy to respond to this as well as any other questions that regard funeral escorts or related matters.
    I realize that I am not a LEO, however I will take the risk of being banned as this is a subject that lends itself to far too much confusion as well as outright misinformation, and such misinformation can and has actually placed the escorts, the grieving members of the procession and the public in very real danger.
    Also, please bear in mind that the law regarding funeral processions varies wildly from state to state.

    Under Arizona law funeral escort vehicles are granted all the rights and privileges as any emergency vehicle as under 28-624.
    28-776 does state that red, or red and blue lights and siren are required for use.

    Section B;

    "A funeral escort vehicle or military escort vehicle shall be equipped with at least one lighted lamp exhibiting a red or red and blue light or lens visible under normal atmospheric conditions from a distance of five hundred feet to the front of the vehicle and an audible signal by bell, siren or exhaust whistle as required under section 28-624."

    As a brief reply to your question, we operate with red and blue lights as well as a siren because Arizona state law requires us to do so.

    I've been working funeral escort in Maricopa county for nearly a decade now, and while I can understand the concern from an outside perspective, I can assure you that the individuals that I work with are exceedingly professional and cautious in the manner in which we operate.
    We have zero interest in pretending to be something we are not.
    What we do have an interest in is the safety of the general public, and those in the funeral procession who, in a time of extreme grief are not likely to be able to make sound and safe judgments while operating a motor vehicle on city streets.
    Our duties encompass a great deal more than what the general public witnesses as we are passing through an intersection.

    The links to the statute so far presented are out of date, the current law can be found here

    In regards to speed, yes, the law allows 15 MPH over the posted, however company policy is to only travel at the maximum speed necessary to safely pass the procession in order to arrive at the next intersection in time to take control of that intersection, and clear any traffic as may be needed.
    Our absolute maximum permitted speed via company policy is no more than 55 MPH.

    John M.

    Leave a comment:

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