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EMS Removal of Handcuffs

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  • TX Heat
    replied
    No, the prisoner is yours. EMS should not remove the handcuffs unless you are present and OK it. They don't even needs keys, they could be taken from the EMS personnel.
    If the prisoner is cuffed, an officer should ride with him in the ambulance if possible. Otherwise, if they need him uncuffed for treatment that should worked out before they leave or they may have stop in transit to get the cuffs removed if there is a change in the patient's status to warrant it.

    Leave a comment:


  • patroldog
    replied
    I agree with most of the responders, the cuffs stay on unless I take them off, most sickness/injury that is not obvious is usually of the nature "I don't want to go to jail right now" sickness/injury and the first chance the prisoner gets he/she will take off,,,,,Not on my watch,,,,,EMS don't like it"""""tough""""

    Stay Safe out there

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  • Bing_Oh
    replied
    If I put the cuffs on, they don't come off without my say-so...PERIOD! If EMS or other medical personnel need the cuffs off for medical reasons, they can negotiate with me. If they can give me a good reason to remove the cuffs, and the prisoner isn't being a problem, then I'll consider it. However, there are very few things EMS cannot do to a person in hadcuffs (including putting in an IV).

    Fortunately, in my area, it's rare that we don't see eye-to-eye with EMS or ER personnel. Most of the EMS, docs, and nurses know where the line is drawn when it comes to demanding action from local LE.

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  • C.I.HOG
    replied
    We always ride with one deputy in EMS van. I speak to medical personel first letting them know of my responsibilities to the prisoner and if they have any questions as to ow the prisoner is restrained. After they are on the stretcher/gurney and handcuffed normally in the front for access to arms so in transit I would not be in danger of prisoner having one arm free and the other with a weapon that I can only remove with a hand cuff key. Leg shackles are a must in my book, unless there is an injury to one or both legs then I know with the pain that he/she is in they are not going anywhere.

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  • fed132
    replied
    I was a street medic in an urban setting in NC for 6 years before my current gig. Our agencies policy was if we had a person in LE custody in our unit then there MUST be a LEO in the back as well. Actually, I think this may even be state law, about 15 years ago there was an incident in one of the counties where a subject was in custody and died in the back of the unit while restrained and the EMS crew couldn't perform adequate care due to the restraints. Our agency had a very good working relationship with local LE, pretty much if we needed to have the restraints removed then LE was more than willing to oblige because they knew we were legit.

    On the other side, when I worked for a rural sevice in VA, we went to an accident where a vehicle that had been chased by several LE agencies crashed. Upon arrival, one subject was cuffed and unresponsive, had obvious spinal trauma, my partner asked the LE to uncuff him so we could attend to him. The LEO would not uncuff him, so my partner cut the cuffs off with bolt cutters. That went over well...ROFLMAO

    Leave a comment:


  • Plaso
    replied
    You can do CPR while the bad guy is cuffed! (he says smiling)

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  • pujolsfan146
    replied
    In most cases we will follow the ambulance to the hospital. If a guy gets in handcuffed I usually explain to the ambulance driver and emt's why he is cuffed.

    If he is stable and for some reason they want to remove the restraints I don't see why they can't switch to our frequency and notify us of this before they do it. Either that or if they don't have the freq they could call 911 to relay the info or just simply pull over and we of course would pull over with them to see if there is a problem.

    Leave a comment:


  • Retired Chief
    replied
    Cogslave is absolutly right!
    "you want the cuffs off, doc? no problem."
    Say what, doc? you want the guy cuffed back up? Better call hospital security, I'm on my union-mandated coffee break."

    Leave a comment:


  • NZCadet
    replied
    Granted we see some ****ty stuff, but i have most respect for EMS, coz they will see some stuff that would make me sick!!!

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  • NZCadet
    replied
    EMS should have restraining stuff anyway right?

    Leave a comment:


  • SRT936
    replied
    Originally posted by cogslave View Post
    I've never had a problem with EMS wanting the cuffs off, but every couple of years at the ER, some liberal doc demands they be taken off and we leave the room. After the POS punches/kicks/spits on the doc and knocks the nurse on her rear end, they want them back on asap. I have found it quite amusing.
    That is also my experience. Most of the medics in the field are good and rarely interfere. The ones that have are usually very new on the job with little real world experience. It only takes one battle in the back of moving rig for them to get the picture.

    Docs on the other hand.... I had one scream and yell about a "patient" being cuffed. I removed the cuffs after an admonishment about him being their problem now. I stepped outside the door to prevent an escape. In less then two minutes, the doc is nursing a black eye and screaming and yelling that prisoner (not "patient" now) is out of control. Unfortunately for him, we were now in another state (we're a border community, all the hospitals are on the other side), and informed him that I had no real power there other than to prevent an escape. He would need to have his security or the local PD deal with it now. Oddly enough, I rarely have a problem with that doc anymore.

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  • cogslave
    replied
    cleaning up
    Last edited by cogslave; 07-24-2007, 08:51 AM. Reason: just because

    Leave a comment:


  • GCPD0171
    replied
    Our local EMS will not transport a prisoner in the ambulance without an officer riding with them. My agency and the EMS crews work well together and they usually don't ask us to take the cuffs off. The problem I've always run into is at the hospital when doctors and nurses want them off. Then it depends on how the prisoner has behaved. If I had to fight him to get the cuffs on then they don't come off unless he is unconcious and dying or going into the jail.

    Leave a comment:


  • Seventy2002
    replied
    This is the sort of thing we ought work out ahead of time. If we don't, we end up trying to thrash it out on the roadside, 3 miles south of nowhere, in the rain, at zero dark thirty.
    EMS has much better equipment for immobilization than LE. Put the subject on a backboard, with a spider strap and head immobilizer, and he's there to stay.

    Leave a comment:


  • Resq14
    replied
    Originally posted by exComptonCop View Post
    Absent any form of official policy, perhaps it might be a good idea for your guys to ride to ride in the van with your in custody's.
    That was the conclusion I reached, too, after I calmed down. I guess I wanted to run this by everyone to make sure I wasn't being unreasonable or anything.

    Leave a comment:

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