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  • 2 day suspension!?

    I am currently fighting a 2 day suspension for a "out of policy" pursuit... would love to hear from other LEO's what they think and if something similar would happen in their agencies....

    On a traffic stop, the violator refused to ID and was acting very suspicious... I call for backup, knowing something was up. Dispatch informs me that the license plate is 'not on file'... I began to ask the driver who the car belongs to, I turn away for a second, and she drops it in drive and takes off, nearly running over my foot! I run back to my car and take pursuit.

    The pursuit lasts 7 minutes and goes approx 6.4 miles before it is terminated by a supervisor.

    I immediately shut down. When I take the next freeway exit, I see the violator stuck in traffic at a red light to my left. I exit my vehicle, run up to the violators car, take her into custody and book her.

    This is honestly what happened, and suprisingly nobody questioned the facts, however, I was brought up on charges for engaging in an out-of-policy pursuit, because I was pursuing for "evading alone".

    In the interview, I clearly spelled out that the circumstances, ie, her refusing to ID self, lic plate not on file, and almost hitting me with her car, added up to a whole lot more that a simple traffic infraction! However they maintain that the circumstances do not merit pursuit under our policy, and gave me 2 days on the beach.

    I point out that 1. there was no accident, injury, or property damage and pursuit was engaged in safely, 2. there was a supervisor monitoring who did not terminate the pursuit for 7 minutes and 3. in the last year I know of 2 other pursuits that occurred in my agency for failure to yield that were never investigated or even commented on by administration.

    Would love to hear input....

  • #2
    Sounds like you did solid police work, however, I don't make or interpret your department's pursuit policy, or lack of.

    Request your two days on the beach, in conjunction with your RDO's, and welcome to the beach club
    "Think like a man of action, act like a man of thought" ~Henri Louis Bergson
    ______________________


    ComptonPOLICEGANGS.com

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    • #3
      Don't know your policy but I agree with Compton. Cops that don't get complaints or pickup a few extra days off here and there probably aren't doing their job.
      Sometimes, doing the right thing means p***ing off the bosses.

      "And shepherds we shall be, for thee my lord for thee."

      Originally posted by dontknowwhy
      I still think troopers and deputies who work in the middle of no where with essentially no back up are the 'men among men' of the LEO world.
      Originally posted by weinerdog2000
      as far as your social experiment, if we cant film you then you cant film us, we will arrest you for obstruction of our freedom.

      Comment


      • #4
        Two Day Suspension

        This isn't going to make the suspension go away, but on the Alabama Dept of Public Safety, you'd have gotten an "Atta-Boy" from your Corporal or Sgt. Sounds to me like you did your job.

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        • #5
          What does your union or LDF attorney say? You do have representation on this, don't you?
          Government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. - Ronald Reagan

          I don't think It'll happen in the US because we don't trust our government. We are a country of skeptics, raised by skeptics, founded by skeptics. - Amaroq

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          • #6
            I want a 2 day. Mine have always been one. Two extra days off would be great. I agree with you redders, cops that work endup off while the ones who sit and play cop get the created ot. Such is life.

            I have no opinion about your suspension. good luck with the grievence, thats what its there for.
            It takes a Wolf.......

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            • #7
              You did the right thing. We have a very restrictive chase policy. Sounds like you acted well within it (if it is as bad as ours).

              Fight it. Those "leaders" above you are just being more like politicians instead of police officers.

              Again, sounds like you did the right thing.
              Space for rent .........

              Comment


              • #8
                California

                Originally posted by romanguy View Post
                I am currently fighting a 2 day suspension for a "out of policy" pursuit... would love to hear from other LEO's what they think and if something similar would happen in their agencies....

                On a traffic stop, the violator refused to ID and was acting very suspicious... I call for backup, knowing something was up. Dispatch informs me that the license plate is 'not on file'... I began to ask the driver who the car belongs to, I turn away for a second, and she drops it in drive and takes off, nearly running over my foot! I run back to my car and take pursuit.

                The pursuit lasts 7 minutes and goes approx 6.4 miles before it is terminated by a supervisor.

                I immediately shut down. When I take the next freeway exit, I see the violator stuck in traffic at a red light to my left. I exit my vehicle, run up to the violators car, take her into custody and book her.

                This is honestly what happened, and suprisingly nobody questioned the facts, however, I was brought up on charges for engaging in an out-of-policy pursuit, because I was pursuing for "evading alone".

                In the interview, I clearly spelled out that the circumstances, ie, her refusing to ID self, lic plate not on file, and almost hitting me with her car, added up to a whole lot more that a simple traffic infraction! However they maintain that the circumstances do not merit pursuit under our policy, and gave me 2 days on the beach.

                I point out that 1. there was no accident, injury, or property damage and pursuit was engaged in safely, 2. there was a supervisor monitoring who did not terminate the pursuit for 7 minutes and 3. in the last year I know of 2 other pursuits that occurred in my agency for failure to yield that were never investigated or even commented on by administration.

                Would love to hear input....
                Sounds like you did what you were told and disregarded the pursuit so whats the violation? Do your administrators expect you to ignore arresting the violator when you see her again after you did what you were told to do? Id get a lawyer and concentrate on how you did end the pursuit and how your foot being injured from being run over had to be dealt with otherwise your department by interfering with your arrest creates an unsafe working environment by not dealing with the violator then take your two day suspension and raise them one lawsuit. Oakland must be a crappy place to be a cop with all the liberal socialist programs supporting the criminals and turning their backs on the Police when they need help. You should seek employement else where after you sue as well.
                "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. The MARINES don't have that problem." ....Ronald Reagan

                Comment


                • #9
                  I agree with all that has been said in regards to the fact that it sounds like you did a great job with some solid police work. Just another example of the "powers that be" trying to throw their weight around and act as if they know it all. On another note I could see this result being just the same at my dept. Good luck and I hope you fight it and win.
                  "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

                  I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6
                  .

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Heh....Welcome to the "Beach Club!" With a lack of disciplinary history, you might be able to get a reduction in penalty in the Skelly. Good luck!!

                    Also, keep in mind, it's not just what you articulate in the IA interview, it's what's articulated in the original police report. You articulated well what happened here, and I assume in the IA interview. I have seen some pursuits that have started over the air as a "reckless DUI" (in policy pursuit) but in the report, the initial obs was for a B/O tail light or unsafe lane change (out of policy pursuit). The officers/deps didn't articulate what they saw that made them think "reckless DUI" initially, and that looks bad in the IA interview.

                    I'm not saying this didn't happen, as I haven't read the initial report. Just sayin' is all.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I am not familiar with your agency's pursuit policy, but I can give you this input.

                      1. The pursuit was not a simple "evading" alone!

                      2. 2800.1 VC applies

                      3. The original P/C for the stop applies

                      4. 12500(a) VC applies

                      5. 4000(a) VC applies

                      6. 148 PC applies.

                      Use the above in your reply.

                      Evading alone would apply if, when you lit her up, she failed to stop and yield to your command. Once stopped, she impeded your investigation by failing to provide the necessary identification of her person, the ownership of the vehicle, the proper licensing of herself and the vehicle, the original violation; and, she chose to further exacerbate the situation by driving off and then failing to comply with the commands of an officer.

                      You must have ticked someone off for them to do an adverse action on you.
                      Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence!

                      [George Washington (1732 - 1799)]

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                      • #12
                        Gee, I never received days off before.............only a termination for a three year old halfway investigated incident.........did I forget to mention that I was promoted to supervisor just prior to the termination......and that I am female? Boy! Anyway......don't sweat it.........sounds like you were doing you job........enjoy your days off...........try to make up the difference later with and extra job...........let it go!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          It sounds like you did a great job keeping your eyes open and subsequently making your arrest. GREAT JOB! I agree with the excomptoncop get your suspension to go along with your pass days and drink one for all of us. lol
                          "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything!"-Wyatt Earp

                          "You never know when crazy will show up!"-Irishdep

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Our chase policy is pretty restrictive. I wouldn't have been justified in going after the violator without someone terminating the pursuit earlier. That being said, if I would've conveniently located the vehicle on an exit ramp a few miles down the road, I would've been celebrated, not disciplined. I don't understand the rationale for the suspension. Its not like the dept. is trying to cover themselves because your actions resulted in someone else's injury. I'm not telling you what to do , but If your productivity suffered for the next few weeks, or months then I would understand.
                            Remember, be proactive, but don't do anything.

                            A man should never be ashamed to own that he has been in the wrong, which is but saying... that he is wiser today than yesterday. Jonathan Swift 1667-1745

                            It's only a conspiracy when your party is not in power.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You can follow proceedure all you like, But you did the right thing.
                              In NZ they'd give you a medal!
                              Its doing the right thing that makes you a real cop.
                              We scream for fear of suffering silence. - Savage Garden

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