When Pepper Spray Doesn't Work!

[me again]

Posted by DeputyDan:
I already have my horror story of spraying someone with OC who just shook it off. I had perfect distance from the guy and I pegged him right between the eyes. He just shook it off. He did tear up a bit later on.

I've had two guys that it didn't work on.

We had one crazy guy who just shook it off. He was certifiably crazy and was taking psychotropic medications too. Anyways, when we saw it wasn’t working, we just backed off and gave it some time to kick in. After about five minutes, he gave in and allowed us to cuff him. I’ll never forget what he said, ”It hurts so bad! I’d rather you guys beat the crap out of me than this!”

The other guy was just plain crazy too. He walked up to me with a kitchen knife and stabbed dead center towards my face. I merely moved a little left and doused him with pepper spray. (I would explain why I didn’t shoot him, but it’s a long boring story). It took about 10 minutes for it to kick in on him, but even then it took about 5 of us to cuff him. Can you say dog pile? The bad thing about messing with those guys after you’ve sprayed them is that you get a taste of it yourself while your grappling with them!

[ 08-15-2001: Message edited by: me again ]

[Sgt. Slaughter]

Sometimes there ain't nothing better than an old-fashioned ***-whoopin'!

[Darkwulfe]

Your going to learn that OC will not work on everyone. I have heard up towards 30% of the population are not affected by it. Then you have those who are hyped on on drugs and just won't feel the affects. If someone is "goal oriented" and get's sprayed, he/she is still going to come after you. If he/she is ****ed off enough, OC will not stop them. Don't ever depend on OC, it's a tool to use but never put 100% faith into it.

[John from Maryland]

OC is effective on the vast majority of people. Unfortunately, when it doesn't work, it's usually with the very people we really want it to work on: those who are pain resistant due to drugs, alcohol, mental illness, or goal-orientation. Of course, these are the same people many other techniques are ineffective with.

We train officers that if OC has been used twice in a confrontation with a suspect without success, it probably is not going to work and the officer should transition to another option. As with me-again's culprits, OC may work five minutes later or next weekend when you arrest the guy, but it is unlikely to work right now.

Be safe.

[spurlock]

I've had one or two that oc spray does not effect. I used to use "first defense", but it was too weak for my own taste. Some of the officers now use "devastator" and it has quite a bit better effect on the person. Myself and two other officers have gone to "fox 5.3" and the results have been outstanding! We've not found anyone so far that can withstand the 5.3 million shu's that it produces. We've had to spray several combatants and several strung out on drugs, namely Meth! We sprayed one combatant and the guy passed out instantly! I agree, there's no one cure for all and at times, we will have to use batons, punches, kicks, etc... to get the job done. Oc spray is just another tool to help us perform our job and go home at night in one piece! If one thing does'nt work, then go to the next tool on the list! If you get a chance, switch over to the "fox 5.3". The recovery time is approx. 15 to 20 minutes because it's only 2% pepper. It does'nt sound like it should work very well, but the SHU's are what really have the effect on the person sprayed! It takes someone really jacked up on Meth or PCP to stand up to the heat produced from the 5.3, most of the sprays on the market have 1 to 2 million SHU's. I'm a firm believer in self preservation and going home at night to my wife and daughter. I use whatever it takes to get the job done and keep myself and my fellow officers from getting hurt in the process!

Be Safe and Take Care Of Numero Uno!

[Bonk]

I remember the guy we took on a warrant one morning who, after getting a faceful of Punch2 (2 million SHU) simply wiped his face off, and said, "You shouldn't have done that.." Big ol' rumble followed immediately afterwards.

The trick to using OC is to have an immediate backup plan in mind in case the stuff doesn't work. In most cases that means nightstick or ASP, with further escalation always a possibility.

[Darkwulfe]

Spurlock- I agree with you totally. You hit on the exact reason why all officers period should be exposed to it during training. Not only do we get exposure from using it on somone else it is one of the easiest weapons a perp can get ahold of to use against us. You have to know what it is going to do to you and what to expect. OC affects everyone differently. And it is better to find out in a controlled setting with help right there then in a dark alley with no backup.

[Sgt-E]

My rule with OC is spray once, thump twice. It hasn't failed me yet. Of course I'm from the old school and sometimes just skip the OC and go to the thump twice.

[SpecOpsWarrior]

Originally posted by Sgt-E:
My rule with OC is spray once, thump twice. It hasn't failed me yet. Of course I'm from the old school and sometimes just skip the OC and go to the thump twice.

Amen to that!! I usually just thump twice, I only use the OC when I dont feel like thumping.

[Joseph]

The old thump always seems to have better results. You don't have to worry if it's going to work.

[RCSO-7S05]

I can verify that oc does not work on everybody. you can spray me with oc as well as spray me in the mouth with it. it absolutely has no effect on me. i do feel the heat, but that is about it. I use oc on average of 3 to 4 times a day in a max security prison. i have been contaminated many times, i think a person just builds up a tolerance to it as you would anything else.

[WHC166]

When OC don't work, bring forth the "dork slayer"..........results are usually in your favor!!!

[me again]

Posted by RCSO-7S05:
I use oc on average of 3 to 4 times a day in a max security prison.

U da man!

After all, it is a correctional institute.

[RCSO-7S05]

I did say 3 to 4 times a day. I meant 3 to 4 times a week! sorry about that, i have used that often before though

[DeputyDan]

Geez RCSO, got me going there for a second.

Anyways, in regards to my original post, I switched from the standard OC they give us to Freeze +P. It is a combo of tear gas and OC and alot of guys carry it.

Again, I will never forget the inmate who did not get affected by my spray. For some reason I did not spray him again, I think because I was thinking if it didnt affect him the first time with a dead on burst, how would follow on sprays do any good? Follow on bursts may work, but I decided not to with this guy. I put my spray away and got ready to get hands on (told my jailer next to me to keep his spray out, just in case). I figured the inmate would charge me and I did not want him to get my spray when we played. But the cavalry showed up and the guy gave up.

How bad did the spray affect this guy? When I cuffed him and started to walk him out with another deputy, he saw a female deputy and said, "hey baby." Whoa!