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  • #16
    Originally posted by Trooper4985
    I was the good witness and called something in a year ago... that burned me so I'm not even calling anything in anymore. .
    That is a lovely attitude
    Trooperden, akman75, & azmichelle ignored

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Trooper4985
      Investigator Parisian and similar incidents and think I should carry 'just in case' but never think about when I'm walking out the door...

      Don't take a football move to a gunfight
      Trooperden, akman75, & azmichelle ignored

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      • #18
        Originally posted by 6233108
        Don't take a football move to a gunfight
        You are officially now a POS in my book... and learn to use the edit button POST WHORE!!!
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        • #19
          Originally posted by 6233108
          Don't take a football move to a gunfight
          Exactly what I was thinking.

          I hate to second-guess a dead cop.....but, damn..........
          Talk sense to a fool, and he will call you foolish - Euripides

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          • #20
            what the hell happened to this thread??


            I carry 24/7 when I am on and off duty.
            Deputy Brandy L. Winfield
            RIP - October 14, 2004

            www.ar15armory.com

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            • #21
              Trooper4985,

              This thread is of the type that can cause resentment, so let's try to keep it fact oriented.

              Reference your:

              ...I make refrence to some academies being too college like and not enough like basic training like they should be.
              How do you know this? Is it your opinion, or has research proved this to be true? And if it is true, what can be deduced from it? Have outcomes of one been proven to be superior to those of the other?

              Law enforcement has evolved into a complex profession. The CA AG, in the preamble of the CA PO Legal Sourcebook, addresses this fact, comparing the knowledge required to perform the duties of a cop equal to knowledge of attorneys. Therefore, deriding "college" academies might undermine your argument.

              In CA, we see just the opposite with CHP as is your agency's duties. In CA, CHP has absolutely no municipal law enforcment duties. Except on state property, all criminal acts are under the jurisdiction of county sheriffs or city police departments. Many CHP officers have difficulty transitioning to municipal law enforcment jobs. In fact, one agency of which I am personally aware has had very poor results transitioning CHP officers to traditional law enforcement. However, CHP is arguably the supreme traffic agency in the state. With that written, I would never refer to the CHP academy as a "dog and pony show." It trains their officers to primarily enforce CA Vehicle Code sections. The academy from which I graduated stressed criminal law and procedure, spending the POST mandated minimum on traffic.


              Stay safe,

              JW

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              • #22
                Originally posted by bikepatrol85
                what the hell happened to this thread??
                What happened to this thread? That's easy. The loud mouth know-it-alls took it over in a desparate attempt to put people down and arrogantly claim territorial rights to any and all posts on this website. After all, they ARE the officer.com control freaks that aren't satisfied unless they're looking down their respective noses while speaking to people. You haven't figured it out yet? YOUR opinion doesn't count here, only THEIRS does. If you disagree with them or have an opinion that doesn't conform to their standards, then they'll single you out and begin their little "games." It gets real old real fast. I haven't posted anything on this board in MONTHS because of these reasons. Just a friendly "heads up." Find another site if you want to speak "freely." Look at how they're already bashing this poor "Trooper4985" guy in this thread. It will only get worse, especially if he tries to defend his opinion.
                If it wasn't for STUPID PEOPLE I'd be unemployed.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Mike 842
                  A street cop has a different mindset. You can have your weapon with you a million times , and hopefully , never need it, but what about that millionth and 1, when billy bad axx decides to jack you for your vehicle, or your watch, or your date and sees your Police I.D.? It will matter not what agency you're with ,to him you're "5 0" and your'e a threat to his freedom. You're NOT going to be able to say "Timeout, I left my gun at home!" In this job, you do NOT get do-overs, that's why it's been stressed to you we look out for each other , that's what the "thin blue line " is ,it's all that separates society from anarchy.We have to stick together and respect each other and be there for each other, If you get in a jam, it's going to be a zone unit or Sgt. coming to you, it's NOT going be any of your administration or academy people that advocate there is no brotherhood.
                  Amen Brother. I'm a Probation Officer here in Northern California. We have full arrest powers (probationer, parolee, or not). We're armed on and off duty (in fact I'm still amazed to hear that Probation Officers in other states are unarmed...insane). I work daily with my S.O. and P.D. brothers. The thought of being out to dinner with my wife and running into a cranked up parolee that has had 10 years to think about who hooked him and sent him on his very long Department of Corrections vacation is quite disturbing. Being armed off-duty doesn't mean you act like a cowboy (unfortunately, some have that mentality...I think every department has a few). Officer/Public safety is always number one. It's just nice to know if all hell breaks loose you just might have a chance to make it home. Be safe.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by SWATcop
                    Look at how they're already bashing this poor "Trooper4985" guy in this thread. It will only get worse, especially if he tries to defend his opinion.
                    SWAT,

                    Thanks looking out but I can hold my own on an internet fight just as I can while scrapping in the street.

                    Originally posted by Josey Wales
                    Trooper4985,
                    In CA, we see just the opposite with CHP as is your agency's duties. In CA, CHP has absolutely no municipal law enforcment duties. Except on state property, all criminal acts are under the jurisdiction of county sheriffs or city police departments. Many CHP officers have difficulty transitioning to municipal law enforcment jobs. In fact, one agency of which I am personally aware has had very poor results transitioning CHP officers to traditional law enforcement. However, CHP is arguably the supreme traffic agency in the state. With that written, I would never refer to the CHP academy as a "dog and pony show." It trains their officers to primarily enforce CA Vehicle Code sections. The academy from which I graduated stressed criminal law and procedure, spending the POST mandated minimum on traffic.


                    Stay safe,

                    JW
                    Guess what... you are just adding to my arguement that NYSP is one of the best out there because not only are we extremely proficient at Penal law... we have a vast knowledge of even the most obscure V&T, ENCON, and many other laws.

                    About college vs. boot camp academies... It takes someone with a hard edge to be a cop that does the job well and mentally survives 20 years. Going through college classes to teach you how to be a cop without the constant stress that is imposed in a boot camp style academy does allow some guys out on the road that have no business being there and are walking officer safety issues. If you put guys through hell for 6 months... only those that really want it and can deal with constant stress are going to be left at the end.... Most people don't start 'missing mommy' after only a couple of days of being yelled at because there is dust on the blinds in their dorm room.

                    Another thing that boot camp style academies have over college style academies is the biggest thing I look for... professionalism. Maybe professionalism isn't the exact word I'm looking for... (it's been a long day that started out with a fatal MVA)... You can see the diffrence between a young adult that has military training and one that doesn't. The confidence, and the discipline you learn through military training is invaluable when molding a person into what a cop is. The street is the wrong place to learn how to maintain control of a major situation with 10 people yelling at you.
                    Last edited by Trooper4985; 10-12-2005, 08:42 PM.
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                    • #25
                      Damn post button... Double post... sorry
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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Trooper4985
                        About college vs. boot camp academies...
                        How about hiring veterans like my department does. Out of the last sixteen hirees, sixteen are veterans. That spans back to 2002. We hire off the civil service list, and veteran's are hired first. I'd say we are still professional although they stopped sending our guys to the State Police Academy in Sea Girt around 2000. It really depends on the individual Officer.

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                        • #27
                          Trooper....
                          Having a hard edge isn't the be all and end all of being a good cop......in a lot of situations the tough guy routine is just not going to work.......come on a scene with with a victim and a perp and their families...a dozen or so on each side......you don't know how long it will take for your back up to arrive...do you think a tough guy and his 9 will scare off two dozen mutts? The hard guy image might work with your home bound businessman, but in any big city the cops will tell you you've got to use your ability to read a situation and apply your experience.

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                          • #28
                            Trooper,

                            About college vs. boot camp academies... It takes someone with a hard edge to be a cop that does the job well and mentally survives 20 years. Going through college classes to teach you how to be a cop without the constant stress that is imposed in a boot camp style academy does allow some guys out on the road that have no business being there and are walking officer safety issues. If you put guys through hell for 6 months... only those that really want it and can deal with constant stress are going to be left at the end.... Most people don't start 'missing mommy' after only a couple of days of being yelled at because there is dust on the blinds in their dorm room.
                            Is this your opinion, or do you know of research that will support your thesis that your academy is better than others?

                            I seem to recall that LASD tested the hypothesis that stress academies (I graduated from a high-stress academy) are superior to their non-stress counterparts. From what I recall, after exhaustive research that strictly adhered to scientific methodology, no proof was found to support the hypothesis. When I worked training, I did read a thesis of a CJ grad student that validated the first research. In short, I know of no scientific proof that supports your claim. But if you know where I can find research in support of your claim, please fill me in...I'd love to peruse it!


                            Stay safe,

                            JW
                            Last edited by Josey Wales; 10-13-2005, 08:45 AM.

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                            • #29
                              Back to off-duty carry.

                              Even in my job I keep my 27 within arms reach. Unfortunatly I have an I.D. card and a pretty Gold badge to go with it. The mutts however, don't stop to read the badge or the I.D. Some in my agency advocate not carrying my I.D. / badge, but I have a confidential registration on my vehicle. Having learned a hard lesson with that I always carry my I.D. hence my best friend is within arms reach at all times.
                              Be alert...the world needs more lerts!

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Trooper4985
                                Do you carry everywhere or just at work? The instinct to act is always there no matter what if you are a cop.... well... I should say if you were meant to be a cop... I've met guys on the road who weren't meant to be cops but made it through the local 'dog and pony show' academy. Back on track... do you carry everywhere off duty where alcohol is not involved or do you only carry when you go certain places? I ask because I went to a pro football game the other day and I was 'patted down'... I don't know what they were looking for because they wouldn't have found anything but that's another issue.

                                Would you carry going to a major sporting event? I thing they are looking for people with Camelbaks full of alcohol not someone with a gun in their waistband.
                                well mr trooper before you put down other cops training/academys, I suggest you get your butt out of your cute little blue and gold police car in upstate NY ,get in the ghetto and do real police work, I dont care how hard the NYST academy is..any real cop will tell you is that you learn the real stuff on the street not in some academy anyway..that is street time,not drivin time sitting on your but 8-10 hrs a day...
                                Im sure you can handle my post,being from NY myself,I still have mt attitude left.. :-)
                                By the way,Noticed you only been on the job since '02 you got a lot to learn rook,before you start trashing other agencys academys....You still wet behind the ears son..

                                "There is no hunting like the hunting of man, and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never care for anything else thereafter."-Ernest Hemmingway
                                Last edited by KalCop; 10-16-2005, 12:05 AM.

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