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Police!! Public Enemy Number 1

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  • Police!! Public Enemy Number 1

    i have been watching carefully and have mad ena observation in l.e. that seems to be the coming standard and i thought i would fish for your opinions.
    it seems in smaller towns, 25000, and below especially, that when an officer gets a complaint the officer is wrong. no matter the situation, your the bad guy. in really small departments such as 4 man to 30 man its seems to be the worst. you stop someone for running a stop sign and even have some heart and write a ticket and they come complain about you bothering them. and then the mayor or council member or chief or whoever is mad at you. not because you actualy did wrong but because your their common problem. the person is mad because you bothered them and the official is mad because they are being bothered because of you. then you get chewed out. i am bringing this up because i got complained on for setting up on a stop sign after dark watching for someone to run it. well someone did and i just wrote them a warning. well they came to complain to the mayor who had told us about the complaints of people running the stop sign in the first place. the complaint wasnt me stopping them, they agreed that they did run the sign and all that was ok. the complaint was that i didnt have my headlights on when i was watching the stop sign. now i was parked on the side of a residential street blacked out like any other parked car. my unit is slick top with no markings. the mayor said it was decietful for me to lull people into a false security like that by them thinking no one is around. so is he saying the message should be obey the law if there are police around but otherwise do as you please? my mayor was completely ****ed that i was set up on a stop sign with no lights on. what did he think i was going to do when he asked me to set up on the sign?

    its not just this instance im referring to, this is my only time to be complained on for doing what i do that i actually got talked to about it. ive been wrong before when i was new and gotten some complaints where i actually was wrong and of course someone talked to me about that, but nothing ever serious enough for suspension or anything, just simple learning mistakes. it seems to be getting common that if there is a complaint no matter the cause or what happened, the officer is wrong. anyone else got stories like this? i have been talking to other area officers and they are getting this kind of micromanagment from officials outside the department. they write a ticket and if there is a complaint they are wrong no matter what. people who dont work in this profession think whatever a cop does if someone doesnt like it the cop is wrong. is the message l.e. only goes for those who let it happen without complaining?

  • #2
    He actually said you lulled someone into a false sense of security?

    What a moron..

    I don't think I've ever had my lights on when sitting at a 4 way..

    Maybe you should look at a different town or maybe county?

    That's absolutely rediculous.

    Comment


    • #3
      I know some states prohibit the slick top, no markings squad car kind of thing. Thank God Texas is not one of them and I guess Oklahoma is not either. We actually have it written into our Penal Code that simply affording someone the opportunity to commit an offense is not entrapment. I think that is what your mayor is basically saying you did, committed entrapment.

      I have been talked to about how I talk to folks. I should preface this with my working for a small agency (40 officers) and it's incredibly charged politically (university)! If I yell at anyone, I end up getting talked to. Nevermind that the person obviously wouldn't have understood anything else but I have this awful temper apparantly. It would almost seem like I am on the verge of going postal the way the admins always have me talked to. Yet, this has only happened on 4 occasions in 2 years. Considering my level of activity, this is actually pretty good. I usually use the super Mr. Nice Guy approach, which usually works well but there are times it just doesn't....and I usually end up getting hammered for it.

      So that is my bit that I get. Seems like your mayor wants traffic enforcement as far as visibility goes. He wants citizens to SEE that is it taking place. He doesn't want true traffic enforcement, just the appearance of it. That's my interpretation anyway.

      Comment


      • #4
        Dont feel like this happens in small cities it happens in large ones also. People love to call IAB and complain on you. The only difference is the department has over 3000 officers and most complaints are sent back to the precinct to be handled by the shift LT. The ones IAB does handle are almost always dropped. Now dont get me wrong some officers deserve to be complained on, (you all know the ones i'm talking about, the one that you try to hurry up and make scene so you can disregard them so no **** wont be started) and overall IAB is not real heavy handed when it comes to handling complaints. Memphis is a rough city and the Police are allowed to use rough tactics in policing. And no I wont go into detail on that but you can use your imagination. The only rule we have is dont get caught on tape.

        Comment


        • #5
          [QUOTE=The only rule we have is dont get caught on tape.[/QUOTE]


          The rule I had was not only don't get caught on tape, but don't do anything on or off tape that is wrong. Be professional!
          Retired

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by retired
            The rule I had was not only don't get caught on tape, but don't do anything on or off tape that is wrong. Be professional!

            I'm always professional in my conduct, or at least I act a professionally as my peers. I believe you were making an attempt to question how I or my Department police, but I will ignore that and say, "have a good day Retired."

            Comment


            • #7
              Post deleted.
              Last edited by SFairman; 06-24-2011, 04:12 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by HCSO511
                i have been watching carefully and have mad ena observation in l.e. that seems to be the coming standard and i thought i would fish for your opinions.
                it seems in smaller towns, 25000, and below especially, that when an officer gets a complaint the officer is wrong. no matter the situation, your the bad guy. in really small departments such as 4 man to 30 man its seems to be the worst. you stop someone for running a stop sign and even have some heart and write a ticket and they come complain about you bothering them. and then the mayor or council member or chief or whoever is mad at you. not because you actualy did wrong but because your their common problem. the person is mad because you bothered them and the official is mad because they are being bothered because of you. then you get chewed out. i am bringing this up because i got complained on for setting up on a stop sign after dark watching for someone to run it. well someone did and i just wrote them a warning. well they came to complain to the mayor who had told us about the complaints of people running the stop sign in the first place. the complaint wasnt me stopping them, they agreed that they did run the sign and all that was ok. the complaint was that i didnt have my headlights on when i was watching the stop sign. now i was parked on the side of a residential street blacked out like any other parked car. my unit is slick top with no markings. the mayor said it was decietful for me to lull people into a false security like that by them thinking no one is around. so is he saying the message should be obey the law if there are police around but otherwise do as you please? my mayor was completely ****ed that i was set up on a stop sign with no lights on. what did he think i was going to do when he asked me to set up on the sign?

                its not just this instance im referring to, this is my only time to be complained on for doing what i do that i actually got talked to about it. ive been wrong before when i was new and gotten some complaints where i actually was wrong and of course someone talked to me about that, but nothing ever serious enough for suspension or anything, just simple learning mistakes. it seems to be getting common that if there is a complaint no matter the cause or what happened, the officer is wrong. anyone else got stories like this? i have been talking to other area officers and they are getting this kind of micromanagment from officials outside the department. they write a ticket and if there is a complaint they are wrong no matter what. people who dont work in this profession think whatever a cop does if someone doesnt like it the cop is wrong. is the message l.e. only goes for those who let it happen without complaining?
                IMHO you need to leave this dept as fast as you can. There are plenty of agencies out there that will support their officers.
                Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead.

                Comment


                • #9
                  If they don't want you to do your job, find a nice shady place to sit and do a crossword puzzle, eat a long lunch, and read a book.
                  Guns don't kill people. Chuck Norris kills People.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I'm in a department of 90 officers in a town of 50,000.

                    I've found if a complaint goes to IA the cop is presumed guilty. The outcomes are exonerated, sustained, or insufficient evidence. That last one is a common finding meaning you can't prove or disprove the cop did it. In criminal court that would called innocent (or exonerated in our lingo). But in internal affairs it means we think you did it but we can't prove it. And it sits in your record as a black mark because it only takes a few of these before they nail you anyway.

                    Now I must admit it also depends on the internal affairs investigator. We only have one at a given time and in my nine years I've now seen 4 different ones. The first one who did it for the first five years lived for busting cops, all cops are dirty in his mind, and he would make up crap if he couldn't get you. The second was fair to a point but he was so out of touch with the reality of police work (he only did about five years on the street and those were over 20 years ago) that he tended to have a mindset that cops were guilty. The third was retired on duty and you would be hard pressed to get him to do anything. The current one I've no experience with.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Ah, a subject near and dear to my heart...........................

                      I'm lucky that I'm county. We do have "certain rules" with my department, but for the most part, they are real easy to follow cause most of the residents throughout our jurisdiction that we deal with are not idiotic fawktards with nothing better to do than to complain to the boss about our antics, therefore our officer discretion when it comes to dealing with them is pretty much on the money............................................. ......

                      Now with the little towns in our county, it seems like certain people who actually seem to think they are someone apparently have decided upon themselves that they are the watchdog agency for their local PD. All they do is attempt to smother themselves by having their heads up the police officers' asses and complaining about their sand in their vaginas. I mostly hear about it from the officers dealing with this BS, and I just shake my head. Seems like these people don't have enough to worry about in their own personal lives, so they have to get involved with other people and try to fawk up their lives.

                      It's pretty hard in these small OK towns to ignore the drama and moving to a big agency, well of course we are made up from society. My department is far from being drama free, but I've learned how to keep 99% out of my life, so I'm happy where I'm at.
                      "I will not use my patrol car as a desert prerunner unless in pursuit."

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Chief Wiggum
                        IMHO you need to leave this dept as fast as you can. There are plenty of agencies out there that will support their officers.

                        I wish my agency would support us.

                        Remember, the mayor is only concerned about one thing-reelection

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          in my area we work 4 days on and 4 off. i work 4 days at the s.o. and 4 days at this small town on the edge of the county line in the next county. i can see the county line from the city limits. the mayor had an emergency meeting over a dui i took in that blew a .01, my mistake, i new it was a drug d.u.i. but i was too lazy to try for the blood. smelled as though the alcohol would get me there, anyway we live we learn. he was so scared she was going to sue that he called an emergency meeting about it. the chief showed the council what the d.a., the city attorney, and the lawyer for c.l.e.e.t. had to say about it. they said we couldnt be sued. i had the p.c. to suspect her. he ranted and raved and the rest of the council told him that he was alone on this one because they were very pleased with the way we do our jobs. it was nice to see a council stand for what was right for once instead of being scared into something.

                          the county i work for has a sheriff the people call buford if that gives you any inclination as to how it works here. i have never seen a complaint that wasnt true even mentioned to anyone. if a deputy has to fight someone there wont be an inquisition from the sheriff or undersheriff. our sheriff told me when i hired in as a reserve/ dispatcher that he would stand by me as long as i was right, and if i did wrong and thought i was doing right he would stand behind me still. he has never let me or anyone else here down on that. i have seen more than one person come slamming doors into his office to complain. the door slams then opens again as he drags them out of the office and educates them as to the proper way to enter his office. i know a lot of guys work for chief's/sheriff's who worry about trying to kiss every *** in front of them instead of standing for whats right. if you ever have a chance to work for a leader who leads from the front and is still at the front when the heat comes down i suggest you jump at the chance.

                          i let word get out to the mayor of my little burg that he could fire me but he still did a lot of driving in the next county. i think the message got through.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by HCSO511
                            the mayor said it was decietful for me to lull people into a false security like that by them thinking no one is around. so is he saying the message should be obey the law if there are police around but otherwise do as you please?
                            WTF? Because you were not seen or herd does not mean you forced someone to commit a crime. Thus how can it be Decietful since you are not decieveing anyone ..... you dident hide the stop sign did you?
                            I guess that blowing a stop sign makes people feel secure; especially in the fact that they wont get T - Boned by the person comming the opposite direction who does not have a stop sign.

                            I love it when you pull over a DUI just after they left the bar across the street you were parked in.
                            "Hay thats Entrapment" LMAO i love that one. My response.
                            "I did not make you enter that bar get drunk and drive this vehicle."

                            Seems to be kinda the same thing with your stop sign story

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I've had several people complain about similar things, like sitting on private property and doing traffic enforcement on the public roadway. They are uneducated and their complaints aren't worth the air they breathed to be able to utter them. Your council member out to be told as such and be referred to someone he would respect to tell him this since it obviously isn't you. He needs to get a back bone and stop being putty in the hands of idiots.

                              My Chief has told people where they can go if they file frivilous complaints, and has told them in no uncertain terms that he will not even follow up with a complaint until is is written and notarized. He then tells the people if any part of it is untrue, they will be prosecuted. How's that for back bone? I like him for this, I just wish he would do more for assuring our training and equipement budget doesn't get cut, and has a faster response on issues we bring to him regarding the council.
                              " (T)o preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them.... " Richard Henry Lee, 1788

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