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  • Off Duty Carry

    Is everyone familiar with HR218 yet? If you said WTF is that, than I guess you're not. I hope by now everone is aware of federal law HR218 that allows LEO's and retired LEO"s to carry anywhere in the US anytime. This might sound stupid because you would think that everyone knows about it, but I continue to hear horror stories that guys are still running into problems out of state. I never bothered a LEO form anywhere before this rule, but why is this still unclear in some situations? I heard that some states refuse to honor it. I can't see how they can do that because it would be like not honoring the carry rights of a federal LEO. I apologize if this an old issue and an old thread, because I'm new on this forum, but I hope that all cops can get on board with this and get it clear so we don't have to worry about getting arrested out of state. Any thoughts or info from your state please?

  • #2
    I haven't heard of a state refusing to honor it. I couldn't imagine an arrest being made based on that alone. Not without that officer becoming extemely rich after the civil suit.
    Last edited by Monkeybomb; 10-31-2009, 12:35 AM.
    The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

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    • #3
      What a novel topic! Did you check for other threads.

      The chief state that is alleged to refuse to honor it is New Jersey. States really don't have a choice.
      Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
      Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Monkeybomb View Post
        I haven'y heard of a vstate refusing to honor it. I couldn't imagine an arrest being made based on that alone. Not without that officer becoming extemely rich after the civil suit.
        I thought the same thing with the civil suit, but I couldn't even think about that before the concern of getting dragged off in front of my family because some knuclehead doesn't know the deal. My state has a special permit for retired LEO's which I have and is contorverseal because why do I need it when I'm covered by HR218 in the first place. A lot of guys agree with that but no one wants to be the test case. I think they re pretty courteous here with that kind of stuff and it would probably not be an isuue, but it's always that one that you gotta look out for and every job has at least one.

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        • #5
          Monkey I agree, I wish I would get arrested somewhere for carrying my authorized, qualified on off duty weapon in a legit venue. I wouldn't be wondering like now about how much house can I afford
          Ignored: Towncop, Pulicords, TacoMac, Ten08

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by coach1299 View Post
            I thought the same thing with the civil suit, but I couldn't even think about that before the concern of getting dragged off in front of my family because some knuclehead doesn't know the deal. My state has a special permit for retired LEO's which I have and is contorverseal because why do I need it when I'm covered by HR218 in the first place. A lot of guys agree with that but no one wants to be the test case. I think they re pretty courteous here with that kind of stuff and it would probably not be an isuue, but it's always that one that you gotta look out for and every job has at least one.

            You still have to have a card that shows the LEOSA requirements have been fullfilled. Our agency issues them in our area. We qualify them once a year for retirees from any state. As long as they live in our jursidiction. As a matter of fact we have managed to get alot of Volunteer instructors with tons of experience.
            The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Monkeybomb View Post
              You still have to have a card that shows the LEOSA requirements have been fullfilled. Our agency issues them in our area. We qualify them once a year for retirees from any state. As long as they live in our jursidiction. As a matter of fact we have managed to get alot of Volunteer instructors with tons of experience.
              So legaly speaking what would you say if you came across me with police ID (retired) and a retired LEO state carry permit to go with it. I'm sure most guys would be fine with that, but if you went to the letter of the law where would I stand?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by coach1299 View Post
                So legaly speaking what would you say if you came across me with police ID (retired) and a retired LEO state carry permit to go with it. I'm sure most guys would be fine with that, but if you went to the letter of the law where would I stand?
                That is letter of the law. Thats all you need.
                The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Monkeybomb View Post
                  That is letter of the law. Thats all you need.
                  ok thanks

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                  • #10
                    What did the retired off duty officer due that got him in a position that caused another officer to find the authorized off duty weapon? I've had numerous encounters with officers out of state. I don't walk up to him and say, "Hey brother, I'm packing..."

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by phillyrube View Post
                      What did the retired off duty officer due that got him in a position that caused another officer to find the authorized off duty weapon? I've had numerous encounters with officers out of state. I don't walk up to him and say, "Hey brother, I'm packing..."
                      I've never had any encounters, and don't know of any except a fellow officer that was pulled over for speeding in Florida, and when he ID himself the officer asked "are you carrying a gun?" My friend felt like he was in a predicament because this was prior to HR218, and my friend said: "do you really want an answer?" and with that the cop kind of caught on and stopped with the gun questioning, and went on to give him a hard time about speeding, but I don't thik that he wrote him. The issue here is not what someone did because no one has done anything to speak of that I know, but rather how it would be viewed from a legal standpoint if an officer was involved in an incident with his gun, and BTW there are some guys like this one mentioned above that like to stir the pot when they don't have to, and it's a good idea to be ready to deal with that in the unlikely event that you run into it.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by coach1299 View Post
                        Is everyone familiar with HR218 yet? If you said WTF is that, than I guess you're not. I hope by now everone is aware of federal law HR218 that allows LEO's and retired LEO"s to carry anywhere in the US anytime. This might sound stupid because you would think that everyone knows about it, but I continue to hear horror stories that guys are still running into problems out of state. I never bothered a LEO form anywhere before this rule, but why is this still unclear in some situations? I heard that some states refuse to honor it. I can't see how they can do that because it would be like not honoring the carry rights of a federal LEO. I apologize if this an old issue and an old thread, because I'm new on this forum, but I hope that all cops can get on board with this and get it clear so we don't have to worry about getting arrested out of state. Any thoughts or info from your state please?

                        Wow, are you confused. HR 218 is passe! It is the "Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act." The Act, now called the Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act of 2004 - 18 USC 926B/18 USC 926C

                        And, yes, there are still issues and that is why the FOP and a number of LE associations have approached their legislators for revisions, additions, corrections and deletions.

                        Here is an excerpt from the FOP newsletter of Spring 2009 and was written by Les Coll of FOP Lodge #1 - Los Angeles County.

                        As of 2009, 48 states have laws permitting CCW if the circumstances
                        merit it. Forty states have Right To Carry (RTC) laws. Thirtysix
                        have “shall issue” permit laws (including Alaska and Vermont,
                        which allow CCW without a permit). California has what is called
                        a “discretionary issue” law, which allows the different agencies statewide
                        to issue or deny CCW permits as they choose. The National
                        FOP is already working with sponsors for the 2009 legislative effort
                        to address some of the issues with H.R. 218, but even if proposed
                        legislation is adopted, the anti-gun crowd will not give up.

                        I have no personal experience that will give the answer as to
                        whether or not Arizona (for example) will honor my CCW authority
                        as permitted on my “Retired Peace Officer” ID card. As in most situations,
                        common sense should prevail. If you intend to travel out of
                        state (not by air) and you need to carry a concealed weapon, I suggest
                        you contact the appropriate state agency regarding their policy.

                        In the next Journal edition, I will follow up on recent gun law
                        changes. The proposal being bandied about by various state and
                        federal legislations include modifying semi-automatic handguns
                        to imprint the weapons’ serial numbers on each cartridge fired,
                        placing a serial number on each cartridge sold and “taxing to the
                        max” all ammunition sold. I will also include the changes recently
                        implemented by the Transportation Security Agency, Department
                        of Homeland Security, regarding Law Enforcement Officers (LEO’s)
                        flying armed.
                        Here is some information about retirees:

                        http://www.policemag.com/Blog/Editor...EOSA-Mess.aspx
                        Last edited by SgtCHP; 10-31-2009, 06:15 PM.
                        Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence!

                        [George Washington (1732 - 1799)]

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          We have no problem recognizing it in Texas, in fact, it's basically codified into our own State law.

                          Beware though:
                          If you come through Texas and are arrested (most likely for DWI) and you have your weapon, LEOSA won't save you. You'll be charged for both the DWI and Unlawful Carrying of a Weapon.
                          sigpic
                          Let your watchword be duty, and know no other talisman of success than labor. Let honor be your guiding star in your dealing with your superiors, with your fellows, with all. Be as true to a trust reposed as the needle to the pole. Stand by the right even to the sacrifice of life itself, and learn that death is preferable to dishonor. ~ Gov. Richard Coke, October 4, 1876

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by DAL View Post
                            What a novel topic! Did you check for other threads.

                            The chief state that is alleged to refuse to honor it is New Jersey. States really don't have a choice.
                            Dal, do you have specifics about NJ not honoring 218? I now our laws are uptight to say the least but I can't imagine a NJ officer even caring if a brother officer is armed. That said I do know that the State doesn't like hollow points and has said you can't use them as an off duty/out of state officer but then we go right back to said NJ brother not caring what you have. Post the link if you don't mind I may have missed it but you are good to go in my patch.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by timmyturner View Post
                              Dal, do you have specifics about NJ not honoring 218? I now our laws are uptight to say the least but I can't imagine a NJ officer even caring if a brother officer is armed. That said I do know that the State doesn't like hollow points and has said you can't use them as an off duty/out of state officer but then we go right back to said NJ brother not caring what you have. Post the link if you don't mind I may have missed it but you are good to go in my patch.
                              No, I do not believe that it happens. I don't think it happened even before LEOSA. However, there have been posts on this forum that asserted that New Jersey was hostile to the law.

                              The one thing I did see some time ago was a memo, which I think came from the New Jersey A.G.'s office, stating that officers from another state could not carry hollow-point ammunition. I am not surprised, because the A.G. is a politician. What he says will matter only once an officer is arrested.
                              Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
                              Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

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