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From SoCal to the South...a bit of a rant

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  • #91
    Don't mistake good luck with good tactics. NEVER, I MEAN NEVER reach into a running automobile.
    Today's Quote:

    "The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
    Albert Einstein

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    • #92
      JP, give it up man. I know how you guys work and working adjacent to the murder capital of the US with yall's g***illion murders and violent crime for years, you guys have managed to keep your LODD to skeleton numbers compared to other countys around the US. It's obvious you guys like us are doing something right, plus we work where our depts give us freedom to improvise as we see best.

      Plus, the Saints are 6-0 anyways who cares, LOL!
      Last edited by creolecop; 10-31-2009, 04:27 PM. Reason: Saint's are 6-0 not 5-0..All these wins are hard to keep up with
      Ignored: Towncop, Pulicords, TacoMac, Ten08

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      • #93
        Officer safety is Universal and I do understand the regional differneces…. The thugs can be just as ruthless here as they are in L.A., so why would you approach them any differently. Every bit of officer safety and tactics that I apply here, were learned on the streets of L.A., if you can make it in L.A., as a cop, you can make it anywhere… I really believe that. There have been plenty of instances where officers I work with have used such poor tactics it scared the Heck out of me…. I have many examples I could point to, but I will share a recent one.

        A call comes out of a person armed with a gun and acting out violently
        (5150), sitting in a driveway. Officer I’m with tells are assisting unit to meet on the scene (What?). I know, based on my experience and training in L.A., you always coordinate on a call like this. So I get back on the radio and coordinate with the other unit so we can role in together. Works out great, both units pull up like clockwork. While pulling up my partner keeps telling me to put my gun away (first mistake, you never tell another officer when or when not to pull out their gun, that is a personal decision, yet it has happened on more than one occasion and I find it highly offensive). I get out and at gun point yell to the suspect to put his hands up turn around go down on his knees and interlace his fingers behind his head. All the while my partner just starts walking up to him immediately reaches for his waist with both hands and starts to search him, never to think to grab the suspect’s hands or that more importantly he put himself in a crossfire situation.Furthermore he didn't appreciate the fact that I set the call up with the other unit after he told them to meet us at the scene. We debriefed afterwards and he didn’t agree with my approach to the situation. I know that my response was appropriate, my partner felt I was being too aggressive, you can’t police like that out here etc… I mention these circumstances as points to learn from and critique, these are by no means bad officers; they just do things differently….

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        • #94
          There seems to be alot of reference to the number of LODD's seen in So CAl particularly the L.A. area. Myself and another Deputy were talking and it raised a good point. L.A. is NOT the most dangerous place to live in the U.S.. L.A. is not absorbed with the most violent criminals in the U.S. Granted L.A. gets alot of publicity with the numerous shows depicting many murderous and crazy situations but There are many other places not just down here with New Orleans (the infamous murder capital) but many other places particularly from the Midwest to the south. Somehow these areas have managed to keep their LODD's far below L.A. area. One could play devils advocate and say L.A. area training could stand to learn a thing or two from these area agencies referenced. They are operating in a more dangerous area with many more people ready to hand out death certificate justice yet they are not dying nearly at the rate of L.A. area LE......Maybe these other areas are just , Lucky, LOL!!........Just thoughts that make you say hmmmmm


          *****EDited in****

          BTW, I'm not for or against or even offering an opinion on the scenario mentioned in the post above this one from the OP. I wasn't there and can't comment on something I didn't see plus, it's only one side of the coin. My post is simply a devils advocate post. oh, yeah, GO SAINTS! & LSU!!

          FORGOT TO MENTION THE SAINTS ARE 6-0 WITH NO REAL COMPETITION LEFT ON THE HORIZON, (big cheese with a wink)
          Last edited by creolecop; 10-31-2009, 04:26 PM.
          Ignored: Towncop, Pulicords, TacoMac, Ten08

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by mdrdep View Post
            Don't mistake good luck with good tactics. NEVER, I MEAN NEVER reach into a running automobile.
            Yeah, I can attest to that one...had the bruises to prove it, too!
            "You're never fully dressed without a smile."

            Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.

            Three things I know for sure: (1) No bad deed goes unrewarded, (2) No good deed goes unpunished, and (3) It is entirely possible to push the most devoted, loyal and caring person beyond the point where they no longer give a 5h!t.

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            • #96
              Every situation is different and should be evaluated on their own merits. I've worked on the west coast and in the south. There were boneheads and awesome cops in both regions, so, imo, it is not a regional thing. Regardless of who thinks who is right or wrong, just remember your training. If you don't have the adequate training to handle the surroundings in which you work, then get it. Always critique yourself and never stop training...never.

              We must all learn from our and others experiences, as well as the situations where our brothers and sisters have made the ultimate sacrifice. Always remember that the most important thing is for you, and your brother/sister officers, to go home safely every day.

              Today is Sunday, it's now time to root for whoever plays the Cowgirls, er, Cowboys, to beat them.
              sigpic

              " 'Blessed are the Peacemakers', is, I suppose, to be understood in the other world, for in this one they are frequently cursed." - Benjamin Franklin

              Comment


              • #97
                The FBI crime stats make it pretty clear that the south is the most dangerous region in the US. Of the 57 officers feloniously killed in 2007, 31 were killed in the south, and 9 in the west. South also had the most felony assaults on officers. Haven't seen the 2008 stats yet.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by creolecop View Post
                  There seems to be alot of reference to the number of LODD's seen in So CAl particularly the L.A. area. Myself and another Deputy were talking and it raised a good point. L.A. is NOT the most dangerous place to live in the U.S.. L.A. is not absorbed with the most violent criminals in the U.S. Granted L.A. gets alot of publicity with the numerous shows depicting many murderous and crazy situations but There are many other places not just down here with New Orleans (the infamous murder capital) but many other places particularly from the Midwest to the south. Somehow these areas have managed to keep their LODD's far below L.A. area. One could play devils advocate and say L.A. area training could stand to learn a thing or two from these area agencies referenced. They are operating in a more dangerous area with many more people ready to hand out death certificate justice yet they are not dying nearly at the rate of L.A. area LE......Maybe these other areas are just , Lucky, LOL!!........Just thoughts that make you say hmmmmm
                  One could also say that the crime stats in LA are lower due to the advanced training and tactics employed by officers who patrol the area.

                  NOPD has had 107 LODD deaths vs LAPD who has had 200. NO has in the neighborhood of 1500 officers servicing 300k (forgive if the numbers are off i didnt spend to much time searching) whereas LAPD has had 9500 +- servicing 4 million people. LAPD - 2 gunfire/aggrevated LODDs in the past ten years. NOPD - 5 gunfire/aggrevated LODDs. Just saying...

                  There IS one major advantage that you have over us...and thats a football team..
                  LAPD

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    There's a lot of reasons why areas have high numbers of officer fatalities. While the "South" seems to have more than their fair share of them, "poor tactics" alone might not be a good explanation for those deaths. In many areas of the country (including the "South") communities don't have the financial resources to provide the same level of basic or advanced officer training that we (in CA) can frequently take for granted. The same departments don't provide as good safety equipment (radios, body armor, etc...) and aren't able to hire as many officers (per capita or per square mile) as even our "strained" agencies can.

                    If a municipality or county only has one or two cars working at a time and they can't get timely assistance, the risk of injury or death increases considerably. If the officer(s) do suffer a life threatening injury, they might not have access to medical care beyond a basic emergency room. In Los Angeles (and other CA cities) "Level 1 Trauma Centers" greatly increase the chance for survival.

                    While I firmly believe LEOs in our state face significant risks, we also have advantages (over other jurisdictions), that provide enhanced safety in our environment.
                    "I'm not fluent in the language of violence, but I know enough to get around in places where it's spoken."

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Code Seven

                      Typing with two fingers isn't a poor way of typing, either...it's "different," but just as good as typing with all ten fingers.

                      I take offense to that one. I happen to type with two fingers and can go 75 words a minute

                      Comment


                      • Code 7, I don't know all the reasons for the higher numbers in the south, but I do know a couple of them. 1. Fewer Officers/ lack of back up. I've seen interviews done with cop killers and most of them cited the fact that the officer they shot was alone as a major factor in their decision to kill the officer. 2. Older or poorer quality equipment. I've seen guys wearing 10 year old vests that felt lucky to have them. I've seen guys with no vests trying to do bake sales to raise money to buy them. 3. Lack of immediate medical care. There are places in my county where it would take an ambulance 2 hours to get to me if I got shot.

                        Some departments out west and in the south have training issues. I'm fortunate to have a Sheriff that believes in training. I've been in 2 OIS's and thanks to my training, I'm still here.

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