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  • 2nd class LEO's?

    I am not sure if this has been talked about before or not. I am almost sure it hes been but it was before my time here.

    Why is it that we in corrections are considered second class LEO's? We deal with the same people that the street cops deal with. Only we do it for a lot longer period of time. Not to mention we do it with fewer tools at our disposal. I guarantee most street cops couldn't / wouldn't do our job. At least not without a side arm.

    I think it is time we as Correctional officers demanded the same respect that the LEO's get.

    Let me know what ya think.
    It's a CERT thing. You wouldn't understand.

  • #2
    It'd help if there were not so many news articles of crooked CO's out there. Cops get a much better view in the public eye than us. Over the years the media has potrayed us as not much better than the inmates we supervise. In my state it'd help if we were even considered law enforcement, here we're part of the Agency of Human Services. Biggest load of crap I've heard of in a while.

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    • #3
      I was down in Washington DC for the Law Enforcement Officers Memorial and the respect I received from Police officers was amazing. Everyone was like "dude, I wouldn't do that job." There are plenty of officers out there who really like this job and proud of the vital service we give to the community. Alot of time the inmate is made to be the good guy and the C.O is the villan. First off, what we need to do is straighten up. Stop getting into trouble, start showing respect for ourselves and our profession.
      If we unite and fight..we can win the day..Save Ogdensburgh or your facility may be next..

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      • #4
        Where I am at we are teated with respect by most street officers. At my agecy, 90% of the Criminal Investigations Division is made of people that at one time or another worked in the same jail that I do.
        Most officers in our county (all agencies) have some experience in either working at a county jail, TDCJ, or both.
        There are those that have never been there or done that, that think that it's a job for morons. I guess that wouldn't be much of an issue, if there were not so many morons working in our field. Face it, it's true. We just can't weed them out fast enough. That is a whole other topic though.

        But, like I said, in my area we don't get much 2nd class BS at all. Most tell us to our faces that they would never be able to do our job. Those that have, most say they would not want to go back and do it again.
        Road Captain
        Blue Knights TX XIX

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        • #5
          It's worse in some places than others. When I worked for Oklahoma DOC even COs who were CLEET certified and commissioned were treated as second class--even though the DOC academy was about 330 hours plus the 370(?) that CLEET required. So, that was about 700 hours of training in law enforcement and corrections when the average cop only had 370 hours of training in law enforcement.

          In Missouri and Kansas the attitude of law enforcement toward COs is much better. Under Kansas statutes COs, with the exception of Kansas state COs (I'm told), are law enforcement officers when it comes to doing certain things like carrying weapons. I know that USP Leavenworth has a good relationship with Kansas law enforcement. Kansas Highway Patrol participates in the few ceremonies we have and the Topeka PD is sending a gang specialist to give us a little training this week. Additionally, the FBI will be putting on training for us this week too. The ten years I worked at the federal prison in El Reno, OK the local FBI agents wouldn't stop to pee on one of us if they saw us on fire at a deserted roadside.
          "Keep up the good fight, pass the word, and teach others to fight back when unjustly assaulted--be it on the street or in the courtroom. Self-defense is a normal, moral act. So teach your family, friends, and students practical defense against both physical and legal marauders." by Jerry VanCook www.PrisonOfficer.Org

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          • #6
            Originally posted by hankrearden2000 View Post
            In Missouri the attitude of law enforcement toward COs is much better.
            Not so.....at least in my part of the state (which is where you live....). In MO, COs are not considered LE and have only three weeks of DOC training and the backgrounds the State does on some is suspect at best.....as I know folks that have no business being COs but still got on because the state is always short-handed......

            I have arrested seveal COs from Crossroads for selling dope, assaulting their wives, assulting folks at bars, driving while intoxicated, etc......and they got no P/C from myself or anyone I worked with......and several of the guys I worked with were prior COs that became LE.....and the horror stories they would tell about some of the folks they worked with made me just shake my head.....

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            • #7
              I've heard plenty of horror stories about Crossroads, although we have got some really good people from there.

              My wife and I have been looking seriously about moving to Kansas. There's another good reason to.
              "Keep up the good fight, pass the word, and teach others to fight back when unjustly assaulted--be it on the street or in the courtroom. Self-defense is a normal, moral act. So teach your family, friends, and students practical defense against both physical and legal marauders." by Jerry VanCook www.PrisonOfficer.Org

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by DOCSatTheGunk View Post
                I was down in Washington DC for the Law Enforcement Officers Memorial and the respect I received from Police officers was amazing. Everyone was like "dude, I wouldn't do that job." There are plenty of officers out there who really like this job and proud of the vital service we give to the community. Alot of time the inmate is made to be the good guy and the C.O is the villan. First off, what we need to do is straighten up. Stop getting into trouble, start showing respect for ourselves and our profession.
                Its really not so much that police officers etc look down on COs. Its the public that has no idea what the corrections field is all about. Bottom line, they see COs as being uneducated knuckle-dragging people in uniform. Until the public's mindset changes, COs will NEVER get the same recognition that police officers get. Thats a fact that will not change. Cops are out there in people's homes; In there kitchens, livingrooms etc interacting, talking to their kids, parents etc etc etc etc. The average police officer has a million opportunities to do good things, that directly effects the citizens/public. The public sees that.

                When I worked those cellblocks, I did my job to the best of my ability. That was all I was ever concerned with. Going home in one piece and doing the job well; Nothing more. Worked a max state pen for 10 years and survived. Something I'm quite proud of. The job itself was stressful enough. I refused to accept any added stress, wondering why the citizens/public looked at corrections in a negative way. Or, why I couldn't carry a gun w/o a permit. Or, why that state trooper gave me a ticket etc. You have to be able to look past all that garbage. All you have in there is each other. Screw the public and everyone else out there, who doesn't know what corrections is all about. I always knew that I wasn't a knuckle-dragging person in uniform. I was a professional. A corrections officer. Again, all you have in there is each other.


                Stay Safe!

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                • #9
                  A CO in KS is technically LE. If you look deep in the Kansas Statutes. We are not treated as such, and are only LE when convenient for the state.

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                  • #10
                    I've seen tons of cops come and go here at my institution, they just can't hang. No gun. Someone once told me we ar the catfish of law enforcement. We are considered bottom feeders, but we are the ones that will fight. We are the soldiers.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Dawg View Post
                      I am not sure if this has been talked about before or not. I am almost sure it hes been but it was before my time here.

                      Why is it that we in corrections are considered second class LEO's? We deal with the same people that the street cops deal with. Only we do it for a lot longer period of time. Not to mention we do it with fewer tools at our disposal. I guarantee most street cops couldn't / wouldn't do our job. At least not without a side arm.

                      I think it is time we as Correctional officers demanded the same respect that the LEO's get.

                      Let me know what ya think.
                      We are considered as second class LEO's for the simple fact that most of the CO's act that way. Look at your department and see just what you are working with. The way they carry themselves both on and off duty. Uniform a mess, no professilism about themslves. It is what it is. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, then dammet it is a duck.
                      C O Big Dawg
                      GDC

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by hankrearden2000 View Post
                        I've heard plenty of horror stories about Crossroads, although we have got some really good people from there.
                        Crossroads is a mess..... I know a lot of folks that were lucky enough to flee the area and are doing other things......

                        Originally posted by hankrearden2000 View Post
                        My wife and I have been looking seriously about moving to Kansas. There's another good reason to.
                        You shouldn't be jacked with too bad since your BOP......when it comes to LE status..... KS seems expensive to me in certain parts.....

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                        • #13
                          I have respect for CO's I know what they put up with. I worked corrections 4 years before moving to Police Dept. Honestly from what I could see around my area was the problem with hiring and background investigations at corrections compared to to Police Dept. around here.

                          Here is my theory when I bring my scum bag to jail I'm at your house I play by your rules. Now yes I would show a CO professional courtesy as any other LEO.

                          But it will never end everybody just sees a jailer and you are treated that way by some. But screw them do your job and be proud of it.
                          Where'd you learn that, Cheech? Drug school?

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by hankrearden2000 View Post
                            I've heard plenty of horror stories about Crossroads, although we have got some really good people from there.

                            My wife and I have been looking seriously about moving to Kansas. There's another good reason to.
                            If you buy property over here in Kansas, I think Leavenworth is kind of expensive concerning property taxes. I know it used to be more expensive for cars and such as well. And, like some states you have to pay all the automobiles property taxes in the same month, and take care of your plates only through your county of residence. A couple of things I did like about Missouri was the fact that you could take care of your plates at any county office, the property fees/taxes were lower. I only moved into Kansas so that I didn't have to travel far at all for work. I'm about 10 minutes away.

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                            • #15
                              Back on subject, CO's in the beginning have less standards to meet in some states than other fully commissioned LE. In the BOP all you needed was one years experience as a CO or other similar position in order to meet the requirements. Three weeks of academy and OJT. But, the worst part about this career is the mess ups that come and go. You have some people whose mindset is so much like the inmate, who then become the inmate, complete with prison sentence. I think people's perception of us will not improve all that much simply because we don't interact with the general public for the most part. It is good that some shows have been aired that show the reality concerning corrections, so it increases public awareness at least a little bit.

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