Leader

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Open carry of a firearm in the state of Ohio

Collapse

300x250 Mobile

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Open carry of a firearm in the state of Ohio

    I'm curious to get the reaction of board members who work in Ohio, as to their reaction to this "hypothetical" situation.

    Hypothetical: while on foot patrol duty at the National Night Out festivities in your city, you receive a radio dispatch of a "man with a gun" in the crowd at the town square. No further information is available.

    As you approach the area, a female subject runs up to you and shouts loudly "there's a guy with a gun over here !! Hurry !!". She turns out to have been the original reporting party. She does not report to you that the subject has either brandished the weapon or threatened anyone in any manner. She merely keeps yelling, "he's got a gun ! He's got a gun !".

    You and 3 more officers accompany her. When she points out the subject, you observe a male subject with a female subject, possibly his girlfriend or wife; both are, let's say, in their 30's; a son and daughter, approximately 4 and 9 respectively; and a frail woman in her 80's, in a wheelchair, being pushed by the subject. They are located in the town square area, on a sidewalk adjacent to a city street.

    On his belt, clearly visible, and not concealed in any manner or to any degree, is a large semi-automatic handgun, in a holster. He is otherwise dressed fairly comparably to most of the crowd in the town square (no "biker colors", "gangbanger attire", etc.).

    You and your fellow officers cautiously approach him. As you approach him, he appears to be engaged in a casual conversation with his daughter. You observe no indication that he is under the influence of any illegal substances or intoxicants. You observe no disruptive behavior of any sort on his part, or on the part of any of the people who appear to accompany him.

    You observe no threatening moves, and observe no attempts by him to touch, hold or brandish the weapon. As a matter of fact, you notice that he appears to be somewhat "pinning" the weapon to his side with his elbow, possibly to avoid a possible grab by a passerby. However, he has made no move to draw the weapon.

    By all visible indications, he is merely participating in the night's festivities with individuals who initially appear to possibly be his family. You have observed no disruptive conduct on his part, and have had no reports of disruptive conduct on his part.

    What do you do ? More specifically:

    Do you conduct a "Terry" stop ? If so, on what basis ? To what information are you entitled during this stop, and for what reason ?

    Do you remove the weapon from his holster ? If so, when, how, and what is your justification ?

    Do you place him under arrest ? If so, what is your probable cause to believe he has committed a criminal offense, and what was the offense ?



    I appreciate the input of any readers of this board. Thanks in advance for your assistance.
    Last edited by jazzman; 08-21-2009, 08:18 PM.

  • #2
    Oh i'm getting some popcorn for this one..
    Seriously, the only reason I wanted to be a cop was so I could post anywhere on this forum.

    Comment


    • #3
      Hey! this has all the makings of a mediocre movie plot

      I guess it would depend on whether there was a full moon out on "National Night Out" and how hot the girl looked

      If she was mediocre as well, I would probably just go order a Pizza
      "a band is blowing Dixie double four time You feel alright when you hear the music ring"


      The real deal

      Outshined Pujulesfan Bearcat Chitowndet Sgt Slaughter jthorpe M-11 Lt Borelli L-1Sgt CHP Nikk Smurf Presence1 IcecoldblueyesKimble LADEP ateamer ChiCity R.A.B. Jenners IrishMetal GoldBadge willowdared Monkeybomb PhilipCal pullicords Chit2001 Garbageman Narco CruiserClass Fuzz 10-42Trooper Tex4720 irishlad2nv bajakirch OnThe gurmpyirishmanNYIlliniSgtScott31 CityCopDCcgh6366 FJDave

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by jazzman View Post
        I'm curious to get the reaction of board members who work in Ohio, as to their reaction to this "hypothetical" situation.

        Hypothetical: while on foot patrol duty at the National Night Out festivities in your city, you receive a radio dispatch of a "man with a gun" in the crowd at the town square. No further information is available.

        When she points out the subject, you observe a male subject with a female subject, possibly his girlfriend or wife; both are, let's say, in their 30's; a son and daughter, approximately 4 and 9 respectively; and a frail woman in her 80's, in a wheelchair, being pushed by the subject.

        Do you place him under arrest ? If so, what is your probable cause to believe he has committed a criminal offense, and what was the offense ?

        I think it is fairly obvious from your description that he is kidnapping the frail old woman...plus, if he is with his girlfriend and his children, and they are old enough to tell his wife, then he must be a stupid kidnapper as well. Therefore, as an armed stupid kidnapper, I would probably have to arrest him.
        Lighten up Francis!

        Comment


        • #5
          I would arrest him. Im the police! Nothing will happen to me.
          What Is A Veteran?
          A 'Veteran,' whether active duty, discharged, retired, or reserve is 'someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America,' for an amount of 'up to and including his life.' That is honor, and there are way too many people in this country today who no longer understand that fact.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by BaldOldWhiteGuy View Post
            I think it is fairly obvious from your description that he is kidnapping the frail old woman...plus, if he is with his girlfriend and his children, and they are old enough to tell his wife, then he must be a stupid kidnapper as well. Therefore, as an armed stupid kidnapper, I would probably have to arrest him.
            Also,the woman and kids are probably hostages and he may have the ability to draw that weapon with his elbow. I'd have a sniper "take him out." Then get a hot dog and a Coke...

            Comment


            • #7
              Does anybody know ?

              Some funny bits, but so far, nobody is willing to stick their neck out and actually say what they would do ?

              Come on, guys. Surely somebody will step up. This could easily be you next week. You have to have some idea of what the right call is.

              With all of the learned law enforcement on here, I know somebody has an opinion.

              Remember: this is under OHIO law. In another state, your mileage may vary.....

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by jazzman View Post
                Some funny bits, but so far, nobody is willing to stick their neck out and actually say what they would do ?

                Come on, guys. Surely somebody will step up. This could easily be you next week. You have to have some idea of what the right call is.

                With all of the learned law enforcement on here, I know somebody has an opinion.

                Remember: this is under OHIO law. In another state, your mileage may vary.....
                J***man, this has been covered extensively, and I have even posted about what I would, and have done (in Ohio).

                Seriously, if you search the forums you can find tons of open carry stuff, and CCW stuff as well.

                I have to ask my own hypothetical now... Did a "friend" of yours get arrested or something during the last NNO? And does the poor guy need someone to loan him 50 bucks so he can get a CCW? That way he can avoid the hysterical people that don't like guns, and the officers can quit wasting their time responding on the runs that the hysterical people call in...
                Lighten up Francis!

                Comment


                • #9
                  its funny because i read that same exact scenario on a completely different forum.
                  I don't have to be careful. I got a gun.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jazzman View Post
                    What do you do ? More specifically:

                    Do you conduct a "Terry" stop ? If so, on what basis ? To what information are you entitled during this stop, and for what reason ?

                    Do you remove the weapon from his holster ? If so, when, how, and what is your justification ?

                    Do you place him under arrest ? If so, what is your probable cause to believe he has committed a criminal offense, and what was the offense ?
                    You ask questions like an attorney. Oh, you are an attorney. No comment counselor. I wasn't working that night.
                    The views/opinions expressed here are solely mine. I'm retired and I don't care. I truly do not want to offend anyone, but if you are thin skinned and have no sense of humor, you better find another line of work. Therefore, I don't have to be politically correct and I will exercise my freedom of speech, until it's taken away. May God bless all retirees. We've done our duty and earned our peace.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Based on the information you have given us, I would say this gentleman is just exercising his right to carry a firearm. It sounds to me like he is out with his family, minding his own business. This is a case of people that do not/cannot carry a gun nor understand the laws concerning personal protection weapons.

                      After assessing the situation I would tell the gentleman the reason I was interacting with him. Afterwards, I would explain to the complaintant(s) the man has a right to carry the weapon, thank them for their concern and ask them to continue having a nice evening.
                      Sworn on September 22, 2010

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by AlmostaLEO View Post
                        After assessing the situation I would tell the gentleman the reason I was interacting with him. Afterwards, I would explain to the complaintant(s) the man has a right to carry the weapon, thank them for their concern and ask them to continue having a nice evening.
                        And you would not do any of the above as you're not a Police Officer. The only "interaction" you may have with him is sizing him up for a casket if he croaks in Indiana..

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by AlmostaLEO View Post
                          Based on the information you have given us, I would say this gentleman is just exercising his right to carry a firearm. It sounds to me like he is out with his family, minding his own business. This is a case of people that do not/cannot carry a gun nor understand the laws concerning personal protection weapons.

                          After assessing the situation I would tell the gentleman the reason I was interacting with him. Afterwards, I would explain to the complaintant(s) the man has a right to carry the weapon, thank them for their concern and ask them to continue having a nice evening.
                          Hmmm? Assess, gentleman, interacting, complaintant

                          Left out interface and unsub Very commendable use of words NOT commonly spoken by LEO'S
                          "a band is blowing Dixie double four time You feel alright when you hear the music ring"


                          The real deal

                          Outshined Pujulesfan Bearcat Chitowndet Sgt Slaughter jthorpe M-11 Lt Borelli L-1Sgt CHP Nikk Smurf Presence1 IcecoldblueyesKimble LADEP ateamer ChiCity R.A.B. Jenners IrishMetal GoldBadge willowdared Monkeybomb PhilipCal pullicords Chit2001 Garbageman Narco CruiserClass Fuzz 10-42Trooper Tex4720 irishlad2nv bajakirch OnThe gurmpyirishmanNYIlliniSgtScott31 CityCopDCcgh6366 FJDave

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by RoadKingTrooper View Post
                            Hmmm? Assess, gentleman, interacting, complaintant

                            Left out interface and unsub Very commendable use of words NOT commonly spoken by LEO'S
                            Don't forget "Protocol." That one became instantly popular when 24 started using it in every other sentence.
                            Lighten up Francis!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by BaldOldWhiteGuy View Post
                              J***man, this has been covered extensively, and I have even posted about what I would, and have done (in Ohio).

                              Seriously, if you search the forums you can find tons of open carry stuff, and CCW stuff as well.

                              I have to ask my own hypothetical now... Did a "friend" of yours get arrested or something during the last NNO? And does the poor guy need someone to loan him 50 bucks so he can get a CCW? That way he can avoid the hysterical people that don't like guns, and the officers can quit wasting their time responding on the runs that the hysterical people call in...
                              I posted it because it happened within the last 3 weeks here in Ohio. Yeah, maybe some of you DID see it on another forum. Won't be hard to find.

                              Guy got marched down to the station with his young daughter, charged with Inducing Panic (ORC 2917.31). As soon as the prosecutor got involved, he offered to drop the charges, but only if the guy promised not to sue.

                              I posted it here simply because I was very curious to see if anybody would approach it seriously and tell me what they would or would not do, and why. So far, the only one who would is from outside Ohio.

                              I gotta hope that everybody reading this knows, and who know the law in Ohio, that this guy COMMITTED NO CRIME. Open Carry is perfectly legal in Ohio, for any person who is otherwise entitled to possess the weapon (i.e., not a felon, etc.), and is otherwise entitled to carry it (i.e, not in a bar, or not on private property where weapons are prohibited, etc.).

                              Furthermore, the recommendation for the CHL (not CCW), while certainly an option, is not necessary. He didn't need anyone's permission to carry that hog openly. He was arrested for a crime he never committed, and charged with a crime which, with a simple reading of the statute, the arresting officer would have known he never committed. Pull up the statute, and compare it with the facts. I hope you're scratching your head saying "what were they thinking ??".

                              If you're present LEO, or future LEO -- PLEASE don't screw the pooch like these guys did. You expect civilians to know the law and follow it. That's reasonable - but do you think it's unreasonable for civilians to expect LEO to know the law also ?

                              I don't. I hope you don't.

                              Comment

                              MR300x250 Tablet

                              Collapse

                              What's Going On

                              Collapse

                              There are currently 10958 users online. 544 members and 10414 guests.

                              Most users ever online was 19,482 at 11:44 AM on 09-29-2011.

                              Welcome Ad

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X