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  • Sovereign Citizen...

    I am a part-time tow truck driver and was called by the CSP to come and impound a vehicle because the driver didn't have registration, insurance or even a valid driver's license.

    When the Sergeant asked why she didn't have these items, she handed him a piece of paper to read that cited case law as to why she can't be pulled over or ticketed or have her vehicle impounded..

    He read the first couple of words and much to her dismay, handed it back to her so he could continue to write her up...

    On the ride back to town, she advised me that not only will the ticket not hold up when she appeals it, but the "rookie" Sergeant will get fined, lose his job and possibly spend a year in jail.

    She advised me that I would, more than likely, be called in as a witness when she takes this thing to court. I told her that I didn't hear or see anything and besides that... I am in the final stages of hopefully being accepted into the CSP Academy and I wouldn't be a very helpful candidate to call to the stand.

    I also helped her to understand that the "rookie" Sergeant is a 25 year veteran of the CSP... She wasn't impressed :-)

    Anyone else have to deal with a situation like this as a LEO?
    HONOR ~ DUTY ~ RESPECT

  • #2
    We've had a couple of folks brought into the jail here in Routt County in the past year that have made the same claims. Both were very stubborn and insisted that their civil rights were being violated, and that local law enforcement had no authority to detain them as a sovereign citizen. The courts did not acknowledge their binders full of documents as legal proof of registration or insurance. Both eventually reached agreements with the courts and DA's office, and did not bring their cases to trial. None of the local departments have seen negative repercussions from their actions.

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    • #3
      I spoke with a friend of mine who's been an officer for about 10 yrs and he says that they try and use their "sovereignty" every chance they get... He has experienced similar reactions when they did push the issue into court with having the judge/DA not acknowledge their "Binder O' Stuff"...

      The lady I towed, funny enough, at the time she was stopped, was on her way to teach a law class on how to get out of the very situation she found herself in...

      The vehicle is being held as it is being investigated as possible car theft because she can't provide any paperwork proving her ownership of the vehicle... We'll wait the mandatory 72 hours and then start the process of gaining ownership of her pristine 1984 Tercel Wagon...
      HONOR ~ DUTY ~ RESPECT

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      • #4
        These Sovereign Citizens are a bunch of nut jobs but, are not to be taken lightly. A father and son who were "Sovereign Citizens' killed to officers in West Memphis. I would like to think that most are harmless and that these two were the exception but, you never know.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjqQO...eature=related
        Stupid has no color or race, everyone can participate.

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        • #5
          Ya'll be careful when encountering these dudes. I don't think violent ones are the exception but rather the rule. We've gotten in a couple of chase's with these people, and the ones that we have encountered have been right at the boderline of resisting arrest. If it weren't for two officers being on scene it would have ended up being a knock down drag out fight. Anytime somebody tries to tell me that sovereign citizen stuff I immdediately try to get them detained in cuffs. The ones that we've run into out here seem to be a powder keg, just waiting to go off.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by marauder85 View Post
            Ya'll be careful when encountering these dudes. I don't think violent ones are the exception but rather the rule. We've gotten in a couple of chase's with these people, and the ones that we have encountered have been right at the boderline of resisting arrest. If it weren't for two officers being on scene it would have ended up being a knock down drag out fight. Anytime somebody tries to tell me that sovereign citizen stuff I immdediately try to get them detained in cuffs. The ones that we've run into out here seem to be a powder keg, just waiting to go off.
            Any insight as to why the "Sovereign" ones seem to give you all the trouble? Is it because they are just incredulous that you would feel that you could detain them and things just escalate from there or.. to use a technical legal term.. they are just nut jobs?
            HONOR ~ DUTY ~ RESPECT

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            • #7
              Originally posted by COCollier View Post
              Any insight as to why the "Sovereign" ones seem to give you all the trouble? Is it because they are just incredulous that you would feel that you could detain them and things just escalate from there or.. to use a technical legal term.. they are just nut jobs?
              There life is going to S$*t and they want an excuse to exit from society and all of there troubles.
              Stupid has no color or race, everyone can participate.

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              • #8
                A big part of it, is because of the whole sovereign thing. They become extremely agitated when it comes to any encounter with LE. Mostly because they don't believe in the government therefore your making an illegal stop/arrest which, according to the constitution, they have a right to resist an illegal arrest. They're minds are just all messed up. From what I understand the only LE official they recognize is the Sherrif because he is an elected official by the people.

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                • #9
                  I'm sure the respect they would have for the Sheriff would begin to waver when they realize he is having their car impounded for it not having insurance or any registration...
                  HONOR ~ DUTY ~ RESPECT

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                  • #10
                    Check out this recent 60 minutes video regarding Sovereign Citizens:

                    Who are "sovereign citizens"?

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                    • #11
                      the sovereign citizens' movement has some seriously MURKY beginnings, with alot of Anti gov't types, that use their own brand of revisionist history and pseudo political science to basically skirt the law. As someone else pointed out, they "claim" to repsect and obey the Sheriff's authoritty, but in reality, they don't feel ANY laws or enforcemnt of laws other than "common law" applies to them( and I bet they'd resist enforcement of even common law).

                      Ne hypcoritical issue I notice when people talk about this in support( I actually know police officers who BELIEVE in the B.S of this "movement") is that ,for adherents who don't recognize the authenticity of our current gov't and court system, they are QUCIK to use the "system" when it beneifits them(such as bogus lawsuits, and liens, ficticious tax and legal documents)

                      I am truly shocked and amazed at how many foolish people actually think this country is a failure( especially when compared to the rest of the FAILED world)
                      "we're americans ! We don't quit because we're wrong, we just keep doing it wrong UNTIL it turns out Right"...

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                      • #12
                        One of these idiots almost jammed me up on a background for CSPD. He claims I have violated his commonlaw copyright on his name by mailing him letters. 10 letters, at a judges request, so 20 violations for me and 20 for my firm (he counts the letter and envelope seperately). 40 total, at $500,000.00 per violation. $20,000,000.00 total. I laughed until I found out he had placed a lien on me and reported it to the Secretary of State and Credit Reporting companies. The only funny part was that he is a minister, and writes on the invoice that "Christian Law prohibits the imposition of interest." Good thing, because $20,000,000 was one thing, but the interest was gonna kill me.

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