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  • #16
    What I'm saying is that what is clear to me is obviously not clear to you so maybe you need to read the debates to understand what they were thinking. To be fair, a lot of federal judges need to do the same thing because they are so far out in left field it is insane.
    "Respect for religion must be reestablished. Public debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officials must be curtailed. Assistance to foreign lands must be stopped or we shall bankrupt ourselves. The people should be forced to work and not depend on government for subsistence." - Cicero, 60 B.C.

    For California police academy notes go to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CABasicPolice/

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    • #17
      A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

      People always forget that first little bit.
      Molly Weasley makes Chuck Norris eat his vegetables.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by willowdared
        A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

        People always forget that first little bit.
        Go look up the definition of "militia", both at the time the BOR was written and as codified by Federal law.

        Besides, parsing the Second Amendment according to the rules of the proper usage of the English language, we see that it does not say "There is a right for a militia to own firearms"... it says "Because a militia is necessary, the people have a right to keep and bear arms". "The people" in the Second Amendment is the same "people" as in all the other amendments.

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        • #19
          Exactly!

          All able-bodied male citizens of the United States and all other able-bodied males who have declared their intention to become citizens of the United States, between the ages of eighteen and forty-five.
          "Respect for religion must be reestablished. Public debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officials must be curtailed. Assistance to foreign lands must be stopped or we shall bankrupt ourselves. The people should be forced to work and not depend on government for subsistence." - Cicero, 60 B.C.

          For California police academy notes go to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CABasicPolice/

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          • #20
            Originally posted by jnojr
            Go look up the definition of "militia", both at the time the BOR was written and as codified by Federal law.

            Besides, parsing the Second Amendment according to the rules of the proper usage of the English language, we see that it does not say "There is a right for a militia to own firearms"... it says "Because a militia is necessary, the people have a right to keep and bear arms". "The people" in the Second Amendment is the same "people" as in all the other amendments.

            Hmmm, not sure why you needed to jump on me for that? Just including the entire statement as it applies to the "right to bear arms"
            Molly Weasley makes Chuck Norris eat his vegetables.

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            • #21
              I think he was jumping on you because you took it out of contex. The 1st part explains why the 2nd part is necessary. It doesn't limit the 2nd part in any way. During the debates most found that the 2nd was unecessary due to it being so obvious that they didn't figure anyone would think otherwise. Thank God their was a few cynics with some forethought.
              "Respect for religion must be reestablished. Public debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officials must be curtailed. Assistance to foreign lands must be stopped or we shall bankrupt ourselves. The people should be forced to work and not depend on government for subsistence." - Cicero, 60 B.C.

              For California police academy notes go to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CABasicPolice/

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              • #22
                Originally posted by pkagel
                I think he was jumping on you because you took it out of contex. The 1st part explains why the 2nd part is necessary. It doesn't limit the 2nd part in any way. During the debates most found that the 2nd was unecessary due to it being so obvious that they didn't figure anyone would think otherwise. Thank God their was a few cynics with some forethought.

                Hmmmmmm - m'okay?

                I guess I thought just saying "the right to bear arms" is taking it out of context.

                I think many people today assume that it is an outdated amendment, as we have a standing army. After the chaos of Hurricane Katrina, it seems a timely reminder to all - that as citizens we play a role in our security.

                I am a firm believer in the right to own guns - I just wonder who will be ready to muster when the town bell rings?
                Molly Weasley makes Chuck Norris eat his vegetables.

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                • #23
                  I think the riots showed us that the Korean business owners are more than willing to stand their ground as to the rest of SoCal, we'll see.

                  Originally posted by willowdared
                  I am a firm believer in the right to own guns - I just wonder who will be ready to muster when the town bell rings?
                  "Respect for religion must be reestablished. Public debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officials must be curtailed. Assistance to foreign lands must be stopped or we shall bankrupt ourselves. The people should be forced to work and not depend on government for subsistence." - Cicero, 60 B.C.

                  For California police academy notes go to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CABasicPolice/

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    [QUOTE=\

                    Next, you have to look at the circumstances surrounding the Bill of Rights \
                    Lastly, since when are our communities "safer"? In the times of the Founding Fathers, we didn't have carjackings, drug wars, crack heads, or a welfare society. A man would have been much safer in an Eighteenth Century big city than any of todays big cities.

                    Lastly... there's the basic idea that we are supposed to be free people.

                    ..Actually ,you need only look at the history of policing in this country to know that you are WRONG on that statement that a man would have been safer in cities during the early part of this countries' founding- hence the reason for modern policing(even here in California it got soo bad that in the 19th century San Franscisco had a larger # of ARMED vigilence society members than it did actual military based near the city,Los angeles City Marshal,later police ,were allowed to "shoot first" rather than escort arrestees into custody, and San Diego was so violent, L.A. based posse groups had to ride down and lynch local bad men,killers, and thieves just to keep people from moving out of the city and closing it down.There is a section on officer.com discussion groups about guns/CCW issues/weapons ownership,so rehashing this subject seems a waste- I don't really like the idea of CCWs in the heavily populated areas of california ( far too many idiots and overly scared people who would abuse it) but CCW in the more rural areas of California has always been sensible to me.As far as the stupidity of the city co. of san francisco passing a "NYC style sullivan" law? I think THAT violates the 2nd amendment, as any lawful citizen should have a revolver or pistol or rifle/shotgun in his/her home. I remember various blk/Korean/Hisp shop owners in Central and so.Central L.A. being able to run off looters and protect their properties by show of arms ,when LAPD was literally allowing gangs of looters take what ever they wanted-ONLY Long Beach PD,LASD, culver City,Inglewood, and other assisting So.Calif PDs tried to stop the looting and shooting.what a citz has in his /her home is NOT the Gov'ts BUSINESS unless it is a clear and obvious danger to the entire community- Granpas under/over shotgun in a gun safe ,or a single moms .38 cal snubby in a locked dresser drawer DOESN'T count as a threat to community safety
                    Last edited by DOAcop38; 12-04-2005, 11:43 AM.
                    "we're americans ! We don't quit because we're wrong, we just keep doing it wrong UNTIL it turns out Right"...

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