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California may become a Shall Issue CCW state

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  • California may become a Shall Issue CCW state

    I read on the Front Sight web page that there is gonna be a petition to put a proposition on the ballot making California a Shall Issue CCW state. I think it's a good idea and may help lower our crime rate. Then again, I can see the argument against it as some fools might go overboard with the 417's for minor things. I'm gonna sign it and if it makes it to the ballot, I'll vote for it. What do you guys think?
    65
    Yup let's do it so we can keep our rights and possibly lower the crime rate
    84.62%
    55
    Nope, h*** no, not a good idea
    15.38%
    10
    God made perfect cops.......The rest he put in cars.

  • #2
    I did my first Master's thesis on the impact on violent crime after implementation of shall-issue laws in states, and in every single case, violent crime went down (especially Florida, where the drop was dramatic), while less than 1/10th of 1% of the issued permits were later revoked or suspended due to criminal conduct.
    Talk sense to a fool, and he will call you foolish - Euripides

    Comment


    • #3
      In order for this to be effective, there has to be a way for all law enforcement agencies to check if someone has a CCW.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by SpecialBlend View Post
        In order for this to be effective, there has to be a way for all law enforcement agencies to check if someone has a CCW.
        In states that routinely issue Caw's there's generally a requirement for the possessor to advise LE that he has it upon contact. Failing to notify is unlawful and can result in suspension or revocation of the permit. When my dept responds to calls, dispatch runs the RP and known suspects for weapons registered. Im sure there can be a CLETS input for permits.
        God made perfect cops.......The rest he put in cars.

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        • #5
          I doubt it will happen but we can hope.
          If guns cause crime, all of mine are defective.

          "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who are not."
          Thomas Jefferson

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          • #6
            I think it'll take several court cases before that happens. San Diego seems to be the place where the first will happen, with the appeal on Peruta. One of the main reasons the ruled against him is because "CA has an open carry provision" or some similar wording. Now that CA doesn't have UOC , the door is open to challenge the "may issue" wording. Of course, case law is leaning the other way at the moment.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by SpecialBlend View Post
              In order for this to be effective, there has to be a way for all law enforcement agencies to check if someone has a CCW.
              When you run someone it comes up in CLETS. I have done several traffic stops where it shows on their NCIC that they have a CCW

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              • #8
                There are 2 cases in Calif dealing with concealed carry.
                Richards v. Prieto. To stipluate that self defense is "good cause" and not being prohibited from owning a firearm is "good moral character". Some counties already issue using these definitions.
                Peruta v. County of San Diego deals with the arbritrary issuing of a concealed carry license.
                Both of these cases are stayed pending the outcome of Nordyke v. King, a ban on gun shows on county property.
                The issue seems to be whether strict or intermediate scrutiny is used to decide these cases.
                Other cases in other states are also listed on this site.

                http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/in...st_and_Present

                AB 144 did not ban unloaded open carry. The bill has 116 exepemtions. It is just over regulated.
                Here is a site to all the exemptions.
                http://calgunsfoundation.org/resourc...is-a-faqs.html Click "download"
                Last edited by Rossi357; 01-12-2012, 02:18 PM.

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                • #9
                  CCW permits do not show up in GA. There is no way of knowing unless you're able to check the gcic/ncic log and deduce the numerical ID of the probate court that ordered your warrant check. (and that's just assuming you're able to check the logs) You are also not required to notify LE when stopped.

                  IMO, they should not be tagged to your DL. You are possibly creating a threat in your mind when one doesn't exist. There's no reason you shouldn't just exercise your usual precautions when dealing with any unknown person.

                  My personal rule is not to tell the officer unless I'm asked or ordered out of the car. And at that point, I will clearly tell him while both my hands are on the steering wheel.

                  I however realize that peoples mindsets vary greatly in the SE compared to California. I just see certain cities making the restrictions impossible for permit holders if something like this passed.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by SpecialBlend View Post
                    In order for this to be effective, there has to be a way for all law enforcement agencies to check if someone has a CCW.
                    Whenever we run someone, the computer software automatically searches for the status of driver's licenses/state ID's, arrest warrants, criminal record, and gun permits issued to the person.
                    Talk sense to a fool, and he will call you foolish - Euripides

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                    • #11
                      CCW in CA? Never happen.
                      sigpic
                      Originally posted by Smurfette
                      Lord have mercy. You're about as slick as the business side of duct tape.
                      Originally posted by DAL
                      You are without doubt a void surrounded by a sphincter muscle.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        An initiative would not get the required votes. Most California voters (and legislators) are against the carrying of weapons. If a court somehow defined a desire for self-protection to be "good cause" for anyone, the legislature would change the law to use some more restrictive term. To define "good character" to equate to not being prohibited from owning a firearm is absurd.

                        I should add that I do not think that the legislature could have intended for a desire for self-protection, without more, to constitute good cause, because anyone can assert such a desire, thereby making the requirement superfluous. Therefore, interpreting the term that way would be unreasonable. In fact, statistics show that violent crime rates have declined, so that the general need for self protection is probably only half what it was 30 years ago.
                        Last edited by DAL; 01-12-2012, 09:16 PM.
                        Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. -- Aldous Huxley
                        Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. -- Albert Einstein

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                        • #13
                          So would the CCW be a state wide then and no longer having to go the sheriff offices and apply?
                          I'd rather be judged by 12 rather carried by 6.

                          It should be noted that any and all post that are made are based on my own thought and opinions.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by FJDave View Post
                            CCW in CA? Never happen.
                            It already is, Not Legally mind you, but it is!.....

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DAL View Post
                              An initiative would not get the required votes. Most California voters (and legislators) are against the carrying of weapons. If a court somehow defined a desire for self-protection to be "good cause" for anyone, the legislature would change the law to use some more restrictive term. To define "good character" to equate to not being prohibited from owning a firearm is absurd.

                              I should add that I do not think that the legislature could have intended for a desire for self-protection, without more, to constitute good cause, because anyone can assert such a desire, thereby making the requirement superfluous. Therefore, interpreting the term that way would be unreasonable. In fact, statistics show that violent crime rates have declined, so that the general need for self protection is probably only half what it was 30 years ago.
                              You are probably right that a ballot iniative would never pass.
                              Many counties are already defining self defense as good cause, in spite of what the legislature may or may not have intended.
                              The 2nd amendment codifies the right to self defense that has always existed. (see the Heller decision) I suspect Calif will go shall issue after the next Supreme Court session. (june 2013) Maybe before then, depending on the Nordyke decision.
                              As far as defining "good moral character" good luck on that one.
                              Contrary to your opinion, the Bill of Rights is not the Bill of needs.
                              Would you stop wearing your seat belt because traffice accidents are at a all time low? Would you toss your fire extinguisher because homes are less likely to catch fire than 20 yrs ago?

                              Comment

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