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  • Wanna Be Cop
    replied
    Originally posted by IMachU View Post
    Well, thank God, it never materialized. Maybe they got smart. Maybe they read my post (as they have spies on this board). But it turned out for the better in this case.

    Yea, I was hoping someone who was apart of this movement would step up and respond to the topic. Oh well, maybe we scared them away. They better keep that crap on the east coast.

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Well, thank God, it never materialized. Maybe they got smart. Maybe they read my post (as they have spies on this board). But it turned out for the better in this case.

    Leave a comment:


  • DOAcop38
    replied
    Originally posted by IMachU View Post
    They are supposed to attempt to try this "open carry" in a County park, more notably Whittier Narrows Park, this Saturday. There is a County ordinance against any weapons in a County park, including unloaded guns. If the decide to try this, as stated, they WILL be proned, cuffed, stuffed and booked. The guns will be taken as evidence and booked as well. They can try to sue, but they will not get very far.

    I wonder if any of those guys has an active restraining order against them.....
    The "problem" i have against the idea of ccw and open carry is that people are simply too LAZY to go thru the process to have the issue lawfully pursued !!!!! the "ah got's a right to mah' guns" attitude is plain stupid! "an armed society is a polite society" ?? "sure- when everyone is onboard with FOLLOWING THE RULES- but most aren't or don't seem phased by it.The 2nd amend issue has raged on this site for quite a while,but while quite a few agree that this could work , there are equal #s who don't want ANY regulation whatso ever on the matter.Imagine pulling over a driver that is DUI- you decide he's good to go on the 10-15 and -since he's ARMED and doesn't think you "have the right" to stop him ( mind you,the ego and liqour are talking)- you want an OIS on this !!!???????


    I've been accused of being "anti gun" on the matter, but thats not the case- all I would like to see,as a citizen and a L.E officers, are some "rules of conduct" in possession. In states where they have CCW rights and "stand your ground" laws- there is also EQUALLY HARSH laws toward people who foolishly think they can do whatever they want when they're strapped- Ca laws are flimsy and anyone who's been in courts in so.Calif- cop or citizen- often sit in amazement when ""O-dog" or " Flaco" slide on their one of many gun crime cases1 imgine how little would be done for the avg citizen who gets "Wayward" with a gun????( the naive L.A. city atty's offices gives "please don't be bad" meager non supervised probation to even the gangmembers-just ask one of the arrested shooters of the students at last weeks washington H.S. football game!) ). Shoot at someone who threatens to punch you- JAIL. Pull out a gun and menace someone over verbal threats? jail. and even so much as say something rude about "having a gun" in the presence of a police oficer or gov't official - beucoups JAIL (
    "IF" you live long enough) . and-BTW- private property( i.e. businesses,gov't buildings/facilities) often have the RIGHT to exclude people from carrying firearms on their respective properties without owners consent- joe open "Armed" citizen now has to put his "piece" away before going into a certain restuarant,while Joe Gangbanger doesn't follow that rule-result is that "citizen" still can become a victim.and of course he'll whine to the cops that he /she is still unprotected.


    what sounds fair is that anyone wanting CCW in CA. get at least a 24 hr training class-weapons operation, weapons and the police issues, civil liability, then post a min. liability insurance policy for carrying one before they get a license.(maybe not to cost more than $300- 500 bucks for every thing) goes a long way toward reducing the "a' packing heat" mindset far too many have.

    what alot of folks don't realize is that they are 1) NOT going to often be the "hero of the day" in the next columbine or Virginia Tech or North Hlywd Bof A robbery

    2) CCW or even "open" carry is at best a min. effort to help them protect themselves IF they need it- gangmembers and murderers haven't stopped or significantly reduced their criminal efforts in places where it is okay to go about strapped as a citizen,so people should fully understand that having a gun doesn't exactly promise you the chance of "safety" or security"

    3) just BECUASE you have a CCW or open carry permit, does NOT mean you are one of the "good guys" to local L.E. I would be deeply saddened to arrive on a violent crime in progress and have to shoot some innocent citizen because he or she thought it "best" to help out or pursue a suspect of a crime.

    All a public rally with guns in Whittier Narrows would do is make the local gangbangers THINK they too can roll around with guns in the open.....Hook as many as you can, Sarge !!!!
    Last edited by DOAcop38; 09-25-2008, 08:53 PM.

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  • LA DEP
    replied
    Originally posted by Badkharma View Post
    It didn't come up, and that's why I had to clarify - I was under the impression that pretty much all officers in socal carried off-duty (or had the choice to anyway). Is this not the case in L.A.?
    Yup....we carry off duty....no CCW needed....our creds are our CCW (as a matter of fact, they WONT ISSUE us a separate CCW card....only the reserves get those)

    Leave a comment:


  • DAL
    replied
    People v. Clark, 45 Cal. App. 4th 1147 (1996) seems to be the most recent case to discuss the issue of what a "loaded" gun means. It seems that the meaning depends upon the specific statute under which the defendant is charged.
    Our conclusion that the Legislature intended "loaded" as used in Penal Code section 12031 to reflect the common definition is supported by the court in People v. Heffner (1977) 70 Cal. App. 3d 643, 650 [139 Cal. Rptr. 45], which reached the same conclusion ("the apparent purpose [of the 'loaded' definition] is to make it clear that for purpose of section 12031 the usual meaning of 'loaded firearm' is to apply."). In Heffner, the court noted when the Legislature adopted Penal Code section 12031, it also adopted another Penal Code statute which contained a special definition of "loaded," i.e., that a firearm was loaded if the firearm and unexpended ammunition were in the immediate possession of the same person. This definition applied to the offenses of bringing a "loaded" firearm into certain state governmental offices and residences of certain state officers and legislators. ( People v. Heffner, supra, 70 Cal. App. 3d at p. 650; Pen. Code, § 171e.) Since Heffner, the Legislature has adopted this special definition of "loaded" for the offense of carrying a loaded firearm with an intent to commit a felony. ( Pen. Code, § 12001, subd. (j); 12023.) 1 Significantly, the Legislature has not amended the common definition of "loaded" as used in section 12031 nor elected to provide a specialized definition of "loaded" for Health and Safety Code section 11370.1.

    Section 12031(e) authorizes police officers to inspect weapons to determine if they are loaded:
    (e) In order to determine whether or not a firearm is loaded for
    the purpose of enforcing this section, peace officers are authorized
    to examine any firearm carried by anyone on his or her person or in a
    vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an
    incorporated city or prohibited area of an unincorporated territory.
    Refusal to allow a peace officer to inspect a firearm pursuant to
    this section constitutes probable cause for arrest for violation of
    this section.

    I do not know whether there are any cases that address whether California state law preempts local laws about carrying unloaded weapons. It seems that there have to be some circumstances in which carrying and unloaded weapon is lawful, e.g, in a locked case from your car to your house.

    Leave a comment:


  • Wanna Be Cop
    replied
    Originally posted by jato View Post
    The above is the standard we use in San Diego County. A firearm with an empty chamber and a loaded magazine sitting on the same car seat is considered unloaded. The ammo must not touch the gun.

    Additionally, per our DA liaison, PC 12031 does not apply to legal shooting areas within the unincorporated county.

    Now back on the topic...


    That may be true. Every county is different from the next. I would assume that the persons criminal record would play a role as well as the persons intent to carrying openly.

    I think these gun people are pushing the limits and abusing their rights. Hell, we have the right to free of speech, but you don't see people telling their boss to F-ck off without repercussions.

    Leave a comment:


  • gonzo1510
    replied
    Originally posted by exComptonCop View Post
    Now I'm confused? I thought the topic of the OP was open carry for non LEO types.
    It is... somehow BUG's got worked into the topic.

    Leave a comment:


  • jato
    replied
    It didn't come up, and that's why I had to clarify - I was under the impression that pretty much all officers in socal carried off-duty (or had the choice to anyway). Is this not the case in L.A.?
    Peace Officers do not need CCWs. Any Peace Officer can carry anywhere in the state (& now the entire country).

    Leave a comment:


  • exComptonCop
    replied
    Originally posted by Badkharma View Post
    It didn't come up, and that's why I had to clarify - I was under the impression that pretty much all officers in socal carried off-duty (or had the choice to anyway). Is this not the case in L.A.?
    Now I'm confused? I thought the topic of the OP was open carry for non LEO types.

    Leave a comment:


  • Badkharma
    replied
    Originally posted by LA DEP View Post
    Getting a CCW in LA City or LA County.....where did BUGs come up in this?
    It didn't come up, and that's why I had to clarify - I was under the impression that pretty much all officers in socal carried off-duty (or had the choice to anyway). Is this not the case in L.A.?

    Leave a comment:


  • LA DEP
    replied
    Originally posted by Badkharma View Post
    Wait - are you talking about the actual CCW or dept-issued BUGs?
    Getting a CCW in LA City or LA County.....where did BUGs come up in this?

    Leave a comment:


  • Badkharma
    replied
    Originally posted by LA DEP View Post
    Correct....you are wasting the paper to even apply for one.....

    One of the IE coppers on here said that they are not as uncommon there....not sure if Riverside or SB.....
    Wait - are you talking about the actual CCW or dept-issued BUGs?

    Leave a comment:


  • L8SHIFT
    replied
    Originally posted by L.A Sheriff View Post
    Let those same people walk around with an unloaded weapon in south L.A and they will find themselves being robbed with their own weapon.

    This is not a smart move. CCW is the only smart way to carry if your not wearing a uniform.
    X2 Let em carry, When "ThugNasty" x 5 walks up to em and punks em for it I'll be laughing my ? off taking that report. Thats if the dude is still alive and doesn't try to act like Clint Eastwood and shoot it out, only to realize that by the time you get to #5 he's already shot you.....

    Leave a comment:


  • Mike1904
    replied
    Originally posted by L.A Sheriff View Post
    I saw the videos on that website and my mouth dropped. I don't see this happening in L.A County.... Maybe Riverside County though due to the rural areas.
    Yeah good luck trying to do that in Moreno Valley, the City of Riverside, Murrietta, Perris, Indio, Coachella, or even the rich neighborhoods in Palm Desert or Palm Springs.
    Last edited by Mike1904; 09-20-2008, 01:08 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • jato
    replied
    PC 12031 g) A firearm shall be deemed to be loaded for the purposes of this section when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the firearm.
    The above is the standard we use in San Diego County. A firearm with an empty chamber and a loaded magazine sitting on the same car seat is considered unloaded. The ammo must not touch the gun.

    Additionally, per our DA liaison, PC 12031 does not apply to legal shooting areas within the unincorporated county.

    12031. (a) (1) A person is guilty of carrying a loaded firearm when
    he or she carries a loaded firearm on his or her person or in a
    vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an
    incorporated city or in any public place or on any public street in a
    prohibited area of unincorporated territory.
    Last edited by jato; 09-20-2008, 05:50 AM.

    Leave a comment:

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