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ARS Revision; SB 1242

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  • SHAZAM
    replied
    Here's the deal for Detention Officers. If a DO is qualified for a duty weapon with an agency, then he/her is excempt from taking a CCW course. If we want to carry concealed while off duty, we get a letter from our agency and supply it to the CCW unit at DPS. We atill have to pay the $60 fee to DPS in order to get the concealed permit.

    This only gets us a CCW permit. In no way are we afforded the same priveleges that a Peace Officer gets in carrying a weapon. So, if the average citizen with a CCW permit is not permitted to carry a weapon in a certain place, the same rules apply for the off duty Detention Officer. On Duty Detention Officers can carry anywhere they go, as they are on duty.

    I hope this helps.

    Leave a comment:


  • SDFGlazer
    replied
    Oh!

    Originally posted by StalkerCop View Post
    Your not posting a clear and accurate statement here. DOC officers are NOT sworn peace officers. They are authorized to carry concealed because their weapons training is governed by AZPOST. However they are NOT sworn peace officers. DOC Investigators are sworn peace officers with full police authority.
    Thanks for the clarification!

    Leave a comment:


  • StalkerCop
    replied
    Originally posted by SDFGlazer View Post
    I don't know about the specifics but others, more knowledgeable than I, have posted that

    MCSO are not sworn officers and can not CCW. DOC are sworn officers and can carry CCW.
    Your not posting a clear and accurate statement here. DOC officers are NOT sworn peace officers. They are authorized to carry concealed because their weapons training is governed by AZPOST. However they are NOT sworn peace officers. DOC Investigators are sworn peace officers with full police authority.

    Leave a comment:


  • bkbindustries
    replied
    You can most definetly open carry and I would just stick with that until you are able to physically obtain a CCW

    Leave a comment:


  • C0d3 thr33
    replied
    Originally posted by bkbindustries View Post
    Havent really heard anything yet. I would more less look at this as a grey area. Take it as you wish, it doesnt state that you have to be weapon certified (yet). Just remember it will come down to a judge if you get in trouble and I could see this going either way. If you plan to carry this way I would HIGHLY recomend that you keep some sort of identification with your agency with you at all times.
    I'm not yet 21, but if I was an under-21 DO I would play it safe, turn 21 and get my CCW.

    Something could go south very quickly and ruin a future in law enforcement.

    Thanks for the replies everyone.
    Last edited by C0d3 thr33; 10-16-2009, 03:36 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • bkbindustries
    replied
    Originally posted by C0d3 thr33 View Post
    Are there any Detention Officers in here who have been briefed on the subject?
    Havent really heard anything yet. I would more less look at this as a grey area. Take it as you wish, it doesnt state that you have to be weapon certified (yet). Just remember it will come down to a judge if you get in trouble and I could see this going either way. If you plan to carry this way I would HIGHLY recomend that you keep some sort of identification with your agency with you at all times.

    Leave a comment:


  • InspctrClouseau
    replied
    Originally posted by C0d3 thr33 View Post
    Are there any Detention Officers in here who have been briefed on the subject?
    I haven't received any type of briefing from my agency. I became aware of SB1242 when it passed and now just recently I noticed the revisions were implemented in ARS.

    Leave a comment:


  • C0d3 thr33
    replied
    Are there any Detention Officers in here who have been briefed on the subject?

    Leave a comment:


  • 3oomstick
    replied
    Originally posted by bkbindustries View Post
    Unless I am reading this wrong 13-3102 now says that Correction Officers and Detention Officers are allowed to carry on school grounds and at a public event which I am guessing would mean baseball games, foot ball games etc..? Is this wrong? Does anyone else read different?

    3oomstick- I agree with you and if this is true about the schools grounds and everything I see a big mistake coming. I would keep my eyes open for this to be changing soon.
    13-3102C applied to Correction Officers prior to SB 1242.

    Leave a comment:


  • SDFGlazer
    replied
    Sworn Officer

    Originally posted by bkbindustries View Post
    Unless I am reading this wrong 13-3102 now says that Correction Officers and Detention Officers are allowed to carry on school grounds and at a public event which I am guessing would mean baseball games, foot ball games etc..? Is this wrong? Does anyone else read different?

    3oomstick- I agree with you and if this is true about the schools grounds and everything I see a big mistake coming. I would keep my eyes open for this to be changing soon.
    I don't know about the specifics but others, more knowledgeable than I, have posted that

    MCSO are not sworn officers and can not CCW. DOC are sworn officers and can carry CCW.

    Leave a comment:


  • bkbindustries
    replied
    Unless I am reading this wrong 13-3102 now says that Correction Officers and Detention Officers are allowed to carry on school grounds and at a public event which I am guessing would mean baseball games, foot ball games etc..? Is this wrong? Does anyone else read different?

    3oomstick- I agree with you and if this is true about the schools grounds and everything I see a big mistake coming. I would keep my eyes open for this to be changing soon.

    Leave a comment:


  • C0d3 thr33
    replied
    I'm not a DO or anything, but I imagine MCSO has some type of policy regarding weapons that are carried on the Office's name. No?

    Again, I'm just guessing - Don't most police departments have policies outlining the do's and don'ts for officers who carry on their department credentials?

    Leave a comment:


  • Blkside
    replied
    Thank you.

    Leave a comment:


  • tzbv2p
    replied
    Yes


    Originally posted by Blkside View Post
    I have a question as I am going to apply to some AZ departments when I return.

    As a sworn LEO (Full time PD or SO) are you allowed to carry on your credentials alone?

    Leave a comment:


  • InspctrClouseau
    replied
    Originally posted by 3oomstick View Post
    It does not specifically state "weapon certified" but it is implied or should be. Before SB1242, the exemptions in only applied to Peace Officers, Wardens, Corrections Officers, Military Personnel, and etc. because these members of law enforcement were AZPOST or equivalently trained and certified in the use of firearms. Now Detention Officers are included with the “implied” expectation that they will meet AZPOST qualification. Graduating the DO academy and getting a CCW is not sufficient to be covered under ARS 13-3102C. CCW requires 8-hours of training covering some law, weapon maintenance, marksmanship, and a 10-round 10-yard qualification. Weapon certification for DO’s is equivalent to AZPOST standards. To become weapon certified you have to go through 60+ hours of extensive training, the same as deputies or police officers. Too much liability if they did it any other way.

    By your rational I’ll give you an example:
    A young 18 year old just graduated from a detention officer academy and he found out about ARS 13-3102C on the internet. Wow, now he believes he can go almost anywhere he wants and carry his gun since he can open carry a handgun at the age of 18. Why not, he’s a Detention Officer? ARS 13-3102C states he is exempt from being charged for misconduct involving weapons if he should:
    1. Carrying a deadly weapon without a permit pursuant to section 13-3112 except a pocket knife concealed on his person; or
    2. Carrying a deadly weapon without a permit pursuant to section 13-3112 concealed within immediate control of any person in or on a means of transportation; or
    3. Manufacturing, possessing, transporting, selling or transferring a prohibited weapon, except that if the violation involves dry ice, a person commits misconduct involving weapons by knowingly possessing the dry ice with the intent to cause injury to or death of another person or to cause damage to the property of another person; or
    7. Possessing a defaced deadly weapon knowing the deadly weapon was defaced; or
    10. Unless specifically authorized by law, entering any public establishment or attending any public event and carrying a deadly weapon on his person after a reasonable request by the operator of the establishment or the sponsor of the event or the sponsor's agent to remove his weapon and place it in the custody of the operator of the establishment or the sponsor of the event for temporary and secure storage of the weapon pursuant to section 13-3102.01; or
    11. Unless specifically authorized by law, entering an election polling place on the day of any election carrying a deadly weapon; or
    12. Possessing a deadly weapon on school grounds; or
    13. Unless specifically authorized by law, entering a nuclear or hydroelectric generating station carrying a deadly weapon on his person or within the immediate control of any person;……….

    Do you see what I’m getting at about “weapon certified” Detention officers? SB 1242 should have clarified that only weapon certified detention officers meet the exemptions in 13-3102C.

    InspctrClouseau, I hope you didn’t take this as a slam to you and I didn’t mean any disrespect in what I wrote above, that is just my opinion on the matter and I could be way off base. I can see how adding Detention Officers to the exclusions can be confusing and misleading that’s why I believe that DO’s should be regulated by AZPOST as DOC is but, that is a topic for another thread.
    I understand where you're coming from and frankly, I agree with your point. SB1242 should have clarified that only weapons certified DOs are included, but it didn't and that's the thing...until it does, you really can't argue with the print. With that said and regardless of our own personal opinions, this really does seem to legally authorize detention officers the exemptions of misconduct with weapons. Although I am not a weapons certified DO, I agree that it should be revised to only include those of us that are weapons certified. Until that happens, you really can't argue with the print because that is exactly what it says with no clause distinguishing because agency weapons certification or not.

    Leave a comment:

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