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No credit for some courses from Christian high schools

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Originally posted by DAL View Post

    Otero's ruling Friday, which focused on specific courses and texts, followed his decision in March that found no anti-religious bias in the university's system of reviewing high school classes.
    This is not a sweeping hand saying that all Christian schools are bad. Only specfic courses and texts. Now what kind of texts well read on. . .

    Originally posted by DAL View Post
    For example, in Friday's ruling, he upheld the university's rejection of a history course called Christianity's Influence on America. According to a UC professor on the course review committee, the primary text, published by Bob Jones University, "instructs that the Bible is the unerring source for analysis of historical events" and evaluates historical figures based on their religious motivations.
    If that was the primary text of the course, there should be no credit. I do believe that the Bible is the unerring word of God, but can we really use it for American History? Further more if it bases historical figures only on their religious motivations they are definately missing alot.

    Would anyone support a History class called the Islamic influence on America, where the text book was published by a fundamental Muslim University that says that the "Koran is the unerring source for analysis of historical events?"

    Originally posted by DAL View Post
    Another rejected text, "Biology for Christian Schools," declares on the first page that "if (scientific) conclusions contradict the Word of God, the conclusions are wrong," Otero said.
    If there was a statement in a "Biology for Islamic Schools" says that if scientific conclusions contradict the Koran, science is simply wrong" I would have a problem with it.

    This isn't picking on Christian Schools, it is having a standard for the University.

    I guess the real important factor is how this new ruling is applied. As long as other religions are treated with the same skeptism as Christianity then I deem it fair. If Islamic schools are getting away with this then I have a problem.

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  • livestrong6
    replied
    Originally posted by ray8285 View Post
    Why not? If they are covering the SAME material as other classes but ADDING additional material I see no problem. Based on your post it sounds as if they are teaching evolution just like other schools but ADDING additional information.
    Yes that is a good point. Again what is the point of teaching the scientific method to students when in the same class you teach stories that are not at all in line with the scientific method. That is a direct contradiction to the material being studied. ID and creations should be taught in a different class like phliosophy of christian Science. Not in a science class. That is were the school got it wrong.
    Last edited by livestrong6; 08-30-2008, 10:39 AM.

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  • ray8285
    replied
    Originally posted by damode View Post
    Google: Rewalk

    Apparently its an exoskeleton that helps parapeligics walk. More than likely invented by scientists that believe in SCIENCE.

    SCIENCE - 1, ID, CREATION - 0.

    I think using science to make parapeligics walk is better than making a parapeligic pray daily for the ability to walk. Again, science beats religion
    Weak argument. Just because you are a scientist does not mean you don't believe in God, Jesus, etc. Many scientists who make amazing discoveries are in fact very religious.

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  • ray8285
    replied
    Originally posted by livestrong6 View Post
    Yes, they did teach evolution. however, in the same science class they taugh ID and creation. Two ideas that are basically a story from the bible. How can you give credit in a class that is suppose to be based on science when there is two fictional theories being studied. I wonder how mislead these students are in other classes.
    Why not? If they are covering the SAME material as other classes but ADDING additional material I see no problem. Based on your post it sounds as if they are teaching evolution just like other schools but ADDING additional information.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Google: Rewalk

    Apparently its an exoskeleton that helps parapeligics walk. More than likely invented by scientists that believe in SCIENCE.

    SCIENCE - 1, ID, CREATION - 0.

    I think using science to make parapeligics walk is better than making a parapeligic pray daily for the ability to walk. Again, science beats religion

    Leave a comment:


  • livestrong6
    replied
    Yes, they did teach evolution. however, in the same science class they taugh ID and creation. Two ideas that are basically a story from the bible. How can you give credit in a class that is suppose to be based on science when there is two fictional theories being studied. I wonder how mislead these students are in other classes.

    Leave a comment:


  • ray8285
    replied
    Originally posted by livestrong6 View Post
    They had a interview with some students on CNN.com on what UC was not giving credit for, and it was the science classes. The students that were interviewed mentioned ID, Creation, and then Evolution. Basically they were teaching two christian ways of thinking in a science class. ID is not based in science, and creation is just a story. So how can you get credit for that. Next they will start teaching easter and christmas classes at these schools.
    Because you just said they also taught evolution!!!! Again, they are teaching the same thing, powers that be just don't like the "other stuff" being taught along side of it. How dare there be dissent and opposing views in science!!!!

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  • livestrong6
    replied
    Originally posted by ray8285 View Post
    You guys are missing the big picture. Just because a school teaches creation does not mean they don't teach biology or science. CA wants to deny acceptance because they are taught something CA disagrees with.

    From what I read in the article no where do they talk about what was actually taught, just that they didn't teach agreement with evolution, doesn't mean they aren't taught evolution.
    They had a interview with some students on CNN.com on what UC was not giving credit for, and it was the science classes. The students that were interviewed mentioned ID, Creation, and then Evolution. Basically they were teaching two christian ways of thinking in a science class. ID is not based in science, and creation is just a story. So how can you get credit for that. Next they will start teaching easter and christmas classes at these schools.

    Leave a comment:


  • ray8285
    replied
    Originally posted by Monty Ealerman View Post
    They're denying credit recognition for classes that are nominally science classes but which due to a religious agenda have systematically excluded some science that it is important for their prospective students to be familiar with. They aren't denying credit recognition for classes that don't do the religion-based exclusion.
    You are assuming what they are taught unless you are there in that class. I did not read anywhere what was/was not being taught. The article only said they rejected evolution, not that it was not taught.(nice double negative) My guess would be they teach evolution and then show the flaws in it. Before anyone says it's an irrefutable fact, no, if it was then it would be scientific law.

    Leave a comment:


  • Monty Ealerman
    replied
    They're denying credit recognition for classes that are nominally science classes but which due to a religious agenda have systematically excluded some science that it is important for their prospective students to be familiar with. They aren't denying credit recognition for classes that don't do the religion-based exclusion.

    Leave a comment:


  • ray8285
    replied
    You guys are missing the big picture. Just because a school teaches creation does not mean they don't teach biology or science. CA wants to deny acceptance because they are taught something CA disagrees with.

    From what I read in the article no where do they talk about what was actually taught, just that they didn't teach agreement with evolution, doesn't mean they aren't taught evolution.

    Leave a comment:


  • tony.o
    replied
    They still have Christians in California? I bet they'd give double credit for homo studies.

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  • Monty Ealerman
    replied
    This is just something I grabbed from UC at Berkely:

    http://bigideas2.berkeley.edu/2008%2...ano_Khanal.pdf

    I'm sorry. I didn't see anything about that in Mark's gospel. But that's OK. I'm not trying to use Mark for a biology credit. I think Jesus will understand.

    Leave a comment:


  • Seventy2002
    replied
    The case, ASSOCIATION OF CHRISTIAN SCHOOLS INTERNATIONAL, et al., v. ROMAN STEARNS, et al., is available online.

    Looks like the school didn't have much of a case.


    Faith-based mathematics?

    Leave a comment:


  • livestrong6
    replied
    Originally posted by JMTX View Post
    I don't have a problem with religious schools...as long as they leave religion in religion class and teach science and history in academic classes.

    Honestly, had I chosen to have children, I might very well have chosen to send them to parochial school simply because the public school system is often such a joke...but I would expect that religious teachings would be kept separate from academic teachings.

    At the very least, the teachers could say, "Here is what modern science claims...we know from the bible that this isn't true, but we're going to teach you the THEORY anyway because you may need it if you ever transfer to a public school or attend a public college."
    The only problem with that is Religion has branches that reach into every aspect of education.

    If one goes to a private (religious) school. one will find the long reaching hands of that particular church. Biology class in Junior high (went to public high schools) Evolution, dinosaurs, "Cave Men" as my biology teacher explained, and genetics were all altered to conform to the teaching of the Catholic Church. Evolution was taught as a theory that has many errors and can not be trusted. Dinosaurs was explained as a pre bible event that was not told to the biblical writers. However, I did have a priest once mention dinosaurs were around when Adam and eve were around. Genetics was explained as a tool however, an evil tool and information can't be trusted. Basically they lied to us, filling us with error filled information and not explaining the evidence in a scientific way but in a way that conforms to the teaching of the church.

    bible study had more weight in it then any other class in our curriculum. Getting lower grades in Bible study class could drop your overall grades by a whole letter if not high enough.

    Many other classes had influences of the church in them. History was lined with catholic view of things. Many things the church did not want to teach was omitted or spun to make the church look like hero's. Such as the crusades.

    I feel UC did what they had to do to set standards for high school curriculum's all over the country. Just like colleges may not except all credits from a previous college. The curriculum may be off or the field is not offered at that college. No matter what the reason is the college is in the right to allow them to get the type of student that can go forward in their education. Not to reteach what the student should already know. This is a wake up call for parents thinking they are getting a better education for the kids by sending them to private(religious) schools. They maybe setting there kids up for failure when they enter into a college that does not teach the false ideas of a moral guide to life in the bible.

    Leave a comment:

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