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  • Supplements

    Dose anybody know of good supplements, for lifting. Manily to get good size and to get cut. Also will the supplements test positive for steroids.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Md_5O
    Dose anybody know of good supplements, for lifting. Manily to get good size and to get cut. Also will the supplements test positive for steroids.
    Open ended question here. Alot has to do with genetics and workout routine and then of course diet. Shaklee Physique is clinically proven and has been published in 4 different journals basically showing it raises insulin levels and speed glycogen back into tired muscles. I know of no other "recovery or protein" shake that can do this or at least there is no research to back it up. Just taking shakes isn't going to do it, you need a very strict diet and krj and prowriter are excellent sources for getting that under way. Check out the link below titled "post workout meal". Check out the last two pages for the physique information. I posted some great information that is backed up by research. In short, insulin is the #1 body building hormone in the body and physique does a fantastic job at stimulating insulin after workout.

    To answer your second question: Physique is an all natural supplement. Shaklee has worked with these U.S. Olympic teams as official nutritional consultants in the past. These teams contacted Shaklee corporation to help with their dietary needs. U.S. Ski Teams, U.S. Mens Swimming Teams, and U.S. Track and Field Teams.
    Last edited by Virus; 08-05-2005, 07:12 PM.

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    • #3
      Here is one of my previous posts:

      The Whole Story

      1. The muscle cell is worked out and is tired. It needs glucose and amino acids to recover and build.
      2. Insulin is the main muscle building hormone in the body. It opens the

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      • #4
        Some things to think about when looking for supplements:
        1. Does the product promise quick increases in performance?
        2. Does it contain some secret ingredient?
        3. Is it advertised primarily by use of case histories and testimonials?
        4. Does it use star athletes in its ads?
        5. Does it take a simple truth about a nutrient and exagerate its claim relative to physical performance?
        6. Does it use dated, poorly controlled or non-existent research to support its claims?
        7. Is it expensive?

        If the answer to any of these questions is "yes", then you should be somewhat skeptical of the product and investigate further. In fact the following questions should be asked:

        1. Was any research actually performed?
        2. If so, when and where was it published?
        3. Was it a double blind study?
        4. How many and what type of subjects were used?

        Bottom line is that potential users need to look carefully at the research literature and ignore manufacturers advertisements or testimonials by other athletes. Good research is always published in respected medical/scientific journals. Keep in mind there is no regulation of the nutritional supplement industry. Let the buyer beware is good advice in the purchase and use of supplements as many do not provide any benefit despite their high cost.
        Cowboys in town. Trouble expected.

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        • #5
          Try some creatine. You can go with the new C.E.E. or the 100% pure monohydrate. While it can help you put on some size, you will also probably retain some water with the 100% monohydrate. The new CEE is not supposed to make you hold water. But to each its own. Like the others stated, you also need to have a clean diet and good eating habits. Good Luck! CP

          My Unit

          Charlotte Mecklenburg Police Depart
          Highway Interdiction & Traffic Safety Unit


          Taylor's Sports Products

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          • #6
            Originally posted by PTI
            Some things to think about when looking for supplements:
            1. Does the product promise quick increases in performance?
            2. Does it contain some secret ingredient?
            3. Is it advertised primarily by use of case histories and testimonials?
            4. Does it use star athletes in its ads?
            5. Does it take a simple truth about a nutrient and exagerate its claim relative to physical performance?
            6. Does it use dated, poorly controlled or non-existent research to support its claims?
            7. Is it expensive?

            If the answer to any of these questions is "yes", then you should be somewhat skeptical of the product and investigate further. In fact the following questions should be asked:

            1. Was any research actually performed?
            2. If so, when and where was it published?
            3. Was it a double blind study?
            4. How many and what type of subjects were used?

            Bottom line is that potential users need to look carefully at the research literature and ignore manufacturers advertisements or testimonials by other athletes. Good research is always published in respected medical/scientific journals. Keep in mind there is no regulation of the nutritional supplement industry. Let the buyer beware is good advice in the purchase and use of supplements as many do not provide any benefit despite their high cost.
            I fully agree with PTI's post here. Very important information in this post. Alot of supplements don't have controlled double blind studies. The mind is a powerful tool and double blind studies help to weed out perceived results instead of actual results. Tons of supplements tout outlandish claims. Choose a product that doesn't make these sorts of claims. Also of key importance: I mentioned before that Shaklee consultant numerous US Olympic teams. Shaklee absolutely doesn't "PAY" any athletes to endorse their products. Many companies pay athletes to endorse products and in alot of cases these same athletes don't even use the products they endorse.
            Last edited by Virus; 08-06-2005, 03:10 PM.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by coppilot
              Try some creatine. You can go with the new C.E.E. or the 100% pure monohydrate. While it can help you put on some size, you will also probably retain some water with the 100% monohydrate. The new CEE is not supposed to make you hold water. But to each its own. Like the others stated, you also need to have a clean diet and good eating habits. Good Luck! CP
              This is definately the type of advice to stay away from. Creatine has not once been proven to increase lean muscle tissue in any research done. Think of creatine like a starter of your car, once the starter does it's job, it's no longer needed. Creatine is the same way, you get enough creatine in your normal diet for it to properly do it's job. Stay away from creatine. It will give you false gains in the form of water in the muscle instead of building lean muscle. The leading researcher in the world, whom I don't have his name at the time of this posting has done no research on long term creatine safety and his research also showed no extra lean muscle tissue as a result from creatine loading.

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              • #8
                I have to agree, there's no concrete evidence that creatine works. I took creatine several years ago and I have to admit my strength increased, but it was due more to it giving you a lot of energy moreso than strength. This is why I admire the "old time" bodybuilders like Vince Gironda, Leroy Colbert, Steve Reeves, and many more who as far as I'm concerned did not take steroids of any kind just good ole' fashioned food. Vince Gironda once said the only supplements he took were pure liver tablets that have 45% more protein than protein powders. Mind you these people from yesteryear had amazing physiques that included muscularity, symmetry,and proportion unlike these fat slobs who we call bodybuilders today. I strayed off the topic just stick to food and in my opinion a proven protein powder.

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                • #9
                  I remember emailing Shaklee like a year or two ago and they sent me back a very detailed response as to why they didn't sell creatine. They basically said that they won't sell it because of the lack of research showing positive results as well as creatines function within the body. Mark my word when I say that Creatine supplementation "WILL" fall by the wayside within the next 10 or so years. Remember how Chromium, Amino Acids, Euphedrine and tons of other things have come and gone as the new Miracle Bodybuilding supplements. Tons of these supplements are just loaded with propoganda promising the world and none of them have ever delivered. I took the time to email EAS, Twin Labs and a couple other big supplement companies asking them to send me a bibliography of their research published in refereed/peer review journals and got some interesting responses. Twin Labs never responded to emails so I called them and after being put on hold for a long time they said we don't have any. EAS took it a step further and pointed to abstracts that they had on their website and I said I wanted published research in peer review/refereed journals and they said the FDA doesn't require them to do that so it was a waste of money for them to do the research. One of their abstracts even said that the control group that ate a specific diet with proper protein and carbohydrate levels gained more lean muscle mass than those taking their Myoplex. They took it down within the week. Of course you had to understand what you are reading and without proper schooling it was almost impossible to understand what they were talking about in the abstract. Most companies also come and go throughout the years. As soon as they loose popularity they go away and another one is there to fill the void.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Md_5O
                    Dose anybody know of good supplements, for lifting. Manily to get good size and to get cut. Also will the supplements test positive for steroids.
                    You're only 20 years old - you shouldn't be taking any of that ****.

                    Concentrate your efforts on your physical training and diet.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by krj
                      You're only 20 years old - you shouldn't be taking any of that ****.

                      Concentrate your efforts on your physical training and diet.
                      Thanks KRJ....I know everybody can read my profile. But You don't need to put me personal Info out there!!!!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Md_5O
                        Thanks KRJ....I know everybody can read my profile. But You don't need to put me personal Info out there!!!!
                        Didn't mean to offend Md_50. I know assuming is a dicey proposition (at best), but I assumed if it was in your profile your personal info was ALREADY "out there". Anyway, again, no offense meant.

                        But I stick with my original comment about you and supplements. You're the same age as my sons, and what I would tell THEM is exactly what I told you. Spend your time in the gym, and stay away from supplements at this stage.

                        Only my advice - take it or leave it.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by krj
                          Didn't mean to offend Md_50. I know assuming is a dicey proposition (at best), but I assumed if it was in your profile your personal info was ALREADY "out there". Anyway, again, no offense meant.

                          But I stick with my original comment about you and supplements. You're the same age as my sons, and what I would tell THEM is exactly what I told you. Spend your time in the gym, and stay away from supplements at this stage.

                          Only my advice - take it or leave it.

                          Krj...Hey man no harm done. Thanks for the advice.

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                          • #14
                            Having tried many supplements within the last 2 years I'll tell you some of my experiences with them. Being that I am only 20 years old as well, I try to stay away from most of the crap they sell out there. I've dabbled with creatine on and off and would have to say it's a 50/50 proposition. On the one hand you get some great strength gains, put on some size (mostly due to water), and I felt pretty energetic while on it. On the other hand once you get off of it, most of the weight you've gained will drop due to the lack of water retension. As for side effects, I can't really say I've had any... upset stomach once in a while thats about it. If you would decide to take creatine, just stick with Plain old Creatine Monohydrate. Dont go for the fancy stuff with a bunch of so called miracle ingredients that you cant even pronounce.

                            I've tried NO2. The so-called new miracle in bodybuilding. Don't even try it, its a waste of money. If you need help getting it up, then give it a try. It has some sort of viagra effect to it, i dont know. As far as strength gains. Zero.

                            Protein is one thing i'm sure to take everyday, along with a mulit-vitamin. Other than those I've listed, I havent taken any other supplements. No need to. Nothing beats hard work and dedication when it comes to staying in shape.

                            Hope this helps somewhat on what you were asking.

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                            • #15
                              Stay FAR AWAY from Creatine !!!

                              Originally posted by Virus
                              This is definately the type of advice to stay away from. Creatine has not once been proven to increase lean muscle tissue in any research done. Think of creatine like a starter of your car, once the starter does it's job, it's no longer needed. Creatine is the same way, you get enough creatine in your normal diet for it to properly do it's job. Stay away from creatine. It will give you false gains in the form of water in the muscle instead of building lean muscle. The leading researcher in the world, whom I don't have his name at the time of this posting has done no research on long term creatine safety and his research also showed no extra lean muscle tissue as a result from creatine loading.
                              As already pointed out - all Creatine does is cause the body to store excess water, which gives the illusion of "bulk." Unfortunately, the excess water isn't localized to any one group of muscles and will bulk all muscle tissues ~ including those in the brain and circulatory system. This excess water throws off your body's own pH balance, causing such serious side effects as renal failure, migraine headaches, circulatory distress, etc. THESE NEGATIVE EFFECTS HAVE BEEN DOCUMENTED IN CREATINE USERS time and time again. I've seen various health problems arise with my patients who take this stuff - my advise - steer clear of it ( and hgh too !!!)
                              [FONT=Garamond][SIZE=4][COLOR=Indigo]Oh listen tender lumplings let me take you by the hands...I

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